Imagine if Viofio etc Videos Were This Clear

mentadent

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Dash Cam
VIOFO A229

I can read all the licence plates without issue
 
What dash cam are they using that has image stabilization? Did they mount this in a stabilizing gimbal?
As for the clarity, the image is shot during the day, and they are not driving very fast.
 
Something about these videos just doesn't add up. Although they "appear" to be "dash cam videos", they do not appear to be captured with a dash cam.

  • The author of the videos in the channel posts dozens of videos, yet never once mentions what type of camera he is shooting with.
  • None of the videos in the channel have any of the typical data imprinted on the image that we would normally expect to see in legitimate dash cam footage such as date, time, GPS coordinates, etc.
  • The camera is not mounted on the windshield, but rather at dashboard level and appears to be behind the dashboard, not on it.
  • The footage suggests that the camera is indeed mounted on a mechanical gimbal as @DAP speculates. You can observe this in the video below by the same author if you keep your eye on the moving dashboard.
Comparing footage shot with an actual 4K dash cam with footage shot by some other type of unidentified 4K camera mounted on a mechanical gimbal doesn't exactly tell us much of anything useful, although much improved footage is always a nice fantasy.

 
A friend, many years ago and before dashcams, used to trap a good quality movie camera into the passenger headrest by raising and lowering it. His footage was good quality but he was limited by the micro cassettes length.
 
Something about these videos just doesn't add up. Although they "appear" to be "dash cam videos", they do not appear to be captured with a dash cam.

A recent model GoPro can get video of that caliber. The stabilization and horizon-levelling of the GoPro Hero 10 is pretty darn cool, no gimbal required. And it can do 5.3k video. The problem is, everybody knows that GoPros aren't intended for, and in fact are not really good at, super-long-term recordings such as a dashcam, and lack some of the features that we'd expect in a decent dashcam (overlays without a bunch of effort, etc).
If GoPro were to decide to get into the dashcam market though, I think there may be some shakeups.
 
A recent model GoPro can get video of that caliber. The stabilization and horizon-levelling of the GoPro Hero 10 is pretty darn cool, no gimbal required. And it can do 5.3k video. The problem is, everybody knows that GoPros aren't intended for, and in fact are not really good at, super-long-term recordings such as a dashcam, and lack some of the features that we'd expect in a decent dashcam (overlays without a bunch of effort, etc).
If GoPro were to decide to get into the dashcam market though, I think there may be some shakeups.

Yeah, but whatever a GoPro may or not be able to achieve, the related videos here were clearly created with the use of a mechanical gimbal, so a different camera was involved.

As for shaking up the dash cam industry I'd love to see GoPro or Sony enter into the product category. I imagine a capable camera from either of these companies would be pretty pricey though.
 
Well not much exiting me in small cameras these days,,,, that is until yesterday when i fell over the new Insta360 One RS 1-inch 360 Edition.
That is two 1" sensors,,,,, thats pretty damn sweet.

Sort of make me a little sad i dont have 800 bucks to blow on one.

 
Well not much exiting me in small cameras these days,,,, that is until yesterday when i fell over the new Insta360 One RS 1-inch 360 Edition.
That is two 1" sensors,,,,, thats pretty damn sweet.
Two 1" sensors covering 180 degrees each is equivalent to 4 1/2" sensors covering 90 degrees each, so a little better than our dashcams in light gathering, but not much...

Presumably they are 4K sensors?
Which would be equivalent to a 2K 4 channel dashcam.
 
As for shaking up the dash cam industry I'd love to see GoPro or Sony enter into the product category. I imagine a capable camera from either of these companies would be pretty pricey though.
I 100% agree.
What about Apple too, using the cameras from their cell phones?
I would never buy one, but I think it would accelrate dash cam technology as a whole.
Please forgive my ignorance, as I've only been using dash cams for 2 years now.
But compared to other segments of consumer electronics over the past 40 years, dash cam technology seems to move at a snail's pace.
Is that bad to say? lol
-Chuck
 
I 100% agree.
What about Apple too, using the cameras from their cell phones?
I would never buy one, but I think it would accelrate dash cam technology as a whole.
Please forgive my ignorance, as I've only been using dash cams for 2 years now.
But compared to other segments of consumer electronics over the past 40 years, dash cam technology seems to move at a snail's pace.
Is that bad to say? lol
-Chuck
Have you tried using an Apple iPhone camera as a dashcam at night?
It is not very good, even though it is excellent for handheld photos at night.
 
I 100% agree.
What about Apple too, using the cameras from their cell phones?
I would never buy one, but I think it would accelrate dash cam technology as a whole.
Please forgive my ignorance, as I've only been using dash cams for 2 years now.
But compared to other segments of consumer electronics over the past 40 years, dash cam technology seems to move at a snail's pace.
Is that bad to say? lol
-Chuck

I don't see Apple entering the dash cam market. They are not really a consumer electronics company in the sense that Sony has been for many decades and dash cams are likely too much of a niche market to interest Apple. Another factor is that although Apple has some excellent cameras in their smartphones, tablets, laptops and desktop computers, they are not a dedicated "camera developer" like GoPro or Sony. Sony in particular has a long history of making everything from professional DSLRs and video cameras, camcorders, action cameras, point and shoot pocket cams and others along with a huge range of other consumer electronics, so I see them as a brand with the resources and expertise to enter the dash cam market with a game changing device. For example, I would love to see Sony adapt their technology from their RXO II action camera into a dash cam. The camera has a 1 inch Exmor-R sensor. STARVIS is a designation for sensors within the Exmor R family. Of course, the RXO II is a seven hundred dollar camera but if done right, a dash cam in that price range might actually be worth the money.

It would be great to eventually see Sony develop their high performance Sony Pregius S sensor technology into a product that could be used in dash cams. While it is a sensor designed for industrial machine vision, a version of it could conceivably be adapted for dash cam use and it is already available in a size and format that could work. Apparently, it is already being used in CCTV surveillance cameras. Aside from all of the appealing features it possesses, the main attractions is that it is a back illuminated sensor that uses a global shutter instead of the typical rolling shutter we are all familiar with. A Global Shutter completely eliminates motion blur! Now a sensor like that THAT in a dash cam would really shake things up, wouldn't it! While the Pregius S sensor itself may not end up in a dash cam, a company like Sony has the wherewithal to produce a global shutter sensor that could make motion blur a relic of the past in dash cams.

As for dash cam technology moving at a snails pace, keep in mind that the entire product category has only been in existence for perhaps 15 years or so. It was basically kick-started by small generic Chinese manufacturers who started using available off the shelf components from the CCTV camera industry and small camcorder industry such as M12 (S mount) lenses, SoC chips and memory cards to create a new class of products. Even today most dash cams are still produced by smaller manufacturers who are dependent for major innovations on the whims of the companies that produce the SoC chipsets and sensors that make them tick. A large corporation like Sony or perhaps Nikon would have the resources to design and manufacture their own dash cam chipsets and sensors just like they do for their high end action cameras. We see that same thing with the more recently introduced Hikvision dash cams. Hikvisoin as a company with a wealth of CCTV camera building expertise are another example of a large corporation that can (and has) entered the dash cam market with products to "shake things up". Unfortunately, to date Hikvision dash cams in North America are only available in Canada but not marketed in the US.
 
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A rolling shutter is not the cause of motion blur. A rolling shutter can cause geometric distortion as the object is in different locations for different parts of the frame. Rolling shutter distortion of a license plate could skew the plate, but would not make it unreadable. Motion blur is caused by longer exposures. A long exposure with a global shutter would suffer just as much motion blur as the same exposure with a rolling shutter, the difference is that with a global shutter a square moving object would remain square whereas with a rolling shutter a square moving object would appear as a trapezoid. Both would be equally blurry.
To kill motion blur, you need a short exposure. To get a short exposure, you need a fast sensor. A large aperture gets more light, but reduces the depth of field.
 
Global shutter + true same frame HDR, and maybe starvis 2 that is what i would like to see.
If they made the system as a remote kind, that giving me the ability to hide the main unit, then if the camera was good i would not mind paying a substantial price for it, and leave it in my car when parked.
BUT ! it would have to be a system significant better than what we have nowadays, and i am not even just talking image quality here.
 
A rolling shutter is not the cause of motion blur. A rolling shutter can cause geometric distortion as the object is in different locations for different parts of the frame. Rolling shutter distortion of a license plate could skew the plate, but would not make it unreadable. Motion blur is caused by longer exposures. A long exposure with a global shutter would suffer just as much motion blur as the same exposure with a rolling shutter, the difference is that with a global shutter a square moving object would remain square whereas with a rolling shutter a square moving object would appear as a trapezoid. Both would be equally blurry.
To kill motion blur, you need a short exposure. To get a short exposure, you need a fast sensor. A large aperture gets more light, but reduces the depth of field.

With rolling shutters is that there's an inherent delay between the top section and the bottom section of the sensor being read. When shooting fast moving subjects, this delay can create artifacts such as warping or wobbling in the image or video clip but the rolling shutter delay is also a major factor in contributing to motion blur. A global shutter such as the one provided by the Pregius S can avoid motion blur completely by eliminating lag between frames as it captures the entire frame all at once rather than scanning the frame as with a rolling shutter.

pregius.jpg
 
These were filmed on a GoPro
 
I don't see Apple entering the dash cam market. They are not really a consumer electronics company in the sense that Sony has been for many decades and dash cams are likely too much of a niche market to interest Apple. Another factor is that although Apple has some excellent cameras in their smartphones, tablets, laptops and desktop computers, they are not a dedicated "camera developer" like GoPro or Sony. Sony in particular has a long history of making everything from professional DSLRs and video cameras, camcorders, action cameras, point and shoot pocket cams and others along with a huge range of other consumer electronics, so I see them as a brand with the resources and expertise to enter the dash cam market with a game changing device. For example, I would love to see Sony adapt their technology from their RXO II action camera into a dash cam. The camera has a 1 inch Exmor-R sensor. STARVIS is a designation for sensors within the Exmor R family. Of course, the RXO II is a seven hundred dollar camera but if done right, a dash cam in that price range might actually be worth the money.

It would be great to eventually see Sony develop their high performance Sony Pregius S sensor technology into a product that could be used in dash cams. While it is a sensor designed for industrial machine vision, a version of it could conceivably be adapted for dash cam use and it is already available in a size and format that could work. Apparently, it is already being used in CCTV surveillance cameras. Aside from all of the appealing features it possesses, the main attractions is that it is a back illuminated sensor that uses a global shutter instead of the typical rolling shutter we are all familiar with. A Global Shutter completely eliminates motion blur! Now a sensor like that THAT in a dash cam would really shake things up, wouldn't it! While the Pregius S sensor itself may not end up in a dash cam, a company like Sony has the wherewithal to produce a global shutter sensor that could make motion blur a relic of the past in dash cams.

As for dash cam technology moving at a snails pace, keep in mind that the entire product category had only been in existence for perhaps 15 years and so. It was basically kick-started by small generic Chinese manufacturers who started using available off the shelf components from the CCTV camera industry and small camcorder industry such as M12 (S mount) lenses, SoC chips and memory cards to create a new class of products. Even today most dash cams are still produced by smaller manufacturers who are dependent for major innovations on the whims of the companies that product the SoC chipsets and sensors that make them tick. A large corporation like Sony or Nikon would have the resources to design and manufacture their own dash cam chipsets and sensors. We see that with the more recently introduced Hikvision dash cams. As a company with a wealth of CCTV camera building expertise they are another example of a large corporation that can enter the dash cam market with products to "shake things up". Unfortunately, to date Hikvision dash cams in North America are only available in Canada but not marketed in the US.
Right on Dashmellow,
Thanks for the great reply, and history lesson.
I’ve been a huge fan of Sony Japan since my first walkman. Lol
I love my 1990’s Sony home theater equipment, (still in use today).
Back in 2015 I needed an action cam to “wear” on the side of my motorcycle helmet.
My choice was between the Sony HDR-AS200V, and the current gopro.
I chose the Sony because it had an input for an external mic, eis, build quality, but the major factors were form factor, and company pedigree.

In 2019 I started my YouTube channel by wearing it on a pair of safety glasses, and it’s been my main, and only camera.
I’ve beat the heck out of this thing, and it just won’t die. So sad they don’t make ‘em anymore.
Back then I thought $300 was expensive, but 7 years later it has turned into a huge bargain. It’s 1080p60 is starting to look dated.
I keep looking for a 4K60 replacement, and the only thing close in the Ordro EP8, but it looks to be 2, or 3 generations until they get the kinks worked out to be a Sony equivalent.
-Chuck
 
A rolling shutter is not the cause of motion blur. A rolling shutter can cause geometric distortion as the object is in different locations for different parts of the frame. Rolling shutter distortion of a license plate could skew the plate, but would not make it unreadable. Motion blur is caused by longer exposures. A long exposure with a global shutter would suffer just as much motion blur as the same exposure with a rolling shutter, the difference is that with a global shutter a square moving object would remain square whereas with a rolling shutter a square moving object would appear as a trapezoid. Both would be equally blurry.
To kill motion blur, you need a short exposure. To get a short exposure, you need a fast sensor. A large aperture gets more light, but reduces the depth of field.
The amount of distortion from a rolling shutter depends on how fast it rolls, rolling shutter distortion used to be much worse than it is with the latest and much faster rolling shutter sensors, it's not much of an issue for dashcams these days. Global shutter sensors are used mainly to monitor things on production lines where you can't use rolling shutter because the image is frozen by use of flash illumination (not possible with dashcams), and a rolling shutter would miss much of the flash and thus miss much of the image - this is how it avoids motion blur, not because it has infinitely fast exposure times making motion blur impossible :ROFLMAO:
 
compared to other segments of consumer electronics over the past 40 years, dash cam technology seems to move at a snail's pace.

Thinking about your comments a bit further, I have a few thoughts.

My first "dash cam" was an old Panasonic MiniDV camcorder secured to my dashboard with a big wad of BluTak.

My first real dash cam was a generic model from China called an A-20 that I purchased almost exactly 12 years ago. It offered 1080p resolution at a time when many dash cams on the market back then were still only 720p. Back in those days there were really no North America vendors selling dash cams. If you wanted a dash cam you needed to order directly from China. One of those vendors was an outlet known as Foxoffer who offered a range of generic cams and their own clones of some Chinese "brand" name dash cams, along with other consumer electronics. FoxOffer eventually began manufacturing and selling their own brand name line of cameras and they are now known as Viofo (and GitUp). FoxOffer as an online retail vendor no longer exists.

Anyway, when I first got the A20 I was amazed by the performance of the camera. Back then I had never before owned a video camera that could produce 1080p clips and this was a huge improvident over my old Panasonic camcorder. The camera came with a mini HDMI cable and I recall plugging it into my flat panel TV and being blown away by the first footage I shot. By today's standards however the video was poor. The bit rate was minimal and you would often see pixelization in the images. The dynamic range was poor. WDR did not exist yet. All in all I was very happy to have the capabilities this camera provided to me but like ALL dash cams back in those days it was USELESS at night. The very best one could expect was a very grainy image a few yards in front of bright headlights and nothing more. The camera had two white LEDs for illumination which were totally useless but you could easily slide the camera from its mount and use it as a hand-held camera which could come in handy if you had a fender bender and wanted to capture the damage from outside your vehicle. Like many dash cams back then this one was not 100% reliable. Sometimes, for no apparent reason you would get home and discover that it stopped recording somewhere during your journey and I spent a lot of time and energy fiddling with the cables making sure I had a good connection.

The A-20 camera itself was pretty interesting. It had a flip down tilt-able screen with control buttons and it ran on a replaceable cell phone battery. I bought this one because it was stealthier than most cams of that era that had chrome and splashy logos on them whereas this one was all black. There was no way to know what processor or sensor was in it. It took a maximum 32GB memory card. You just had to pick a cam back then and hope for the best.

So, I don't know if you could call it a "snails pace" but dash camera technology has sure come a long way in my time with them and each iteration adds improvements, features and new capabilities. My current A119 V3s compared to my A-20 from 12 years ago are from different worlds.

The A-20 dash cam. You can still find it online! (the one I had came with a much stealthier mount)
A20.jpeg
 
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Global shutter sensors are used mainly to monitor things on production lines where you can't use rolling shutter because the image is frozen by use of flash illumination (not possible with dashcams), and a rolling shutter would miss much of the flash and thus miss much of the image - this is how it avoids motion blur, not because it has infinitely fast exposure times making motion blur impossible :ROFLMAO:

And yet they are now introducing versions of these back illuminated 4th generation global shutter sensors in CCTV surveillance cameras due to their low light performance, high dynamic range, high gain, low noise and ability to freeze motion with minimal smear! While the technology was designed and built for computer vision it is expanding into other applications.

sony1.jpg

sony2.jpeg


You do not need "flash illumination" with a global shutter to make use of its benefits!

 
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