Is GPS that important for litigation or insurance?

[woorich]

PC World's "freelance contributor" Jon Jacobi opines:

We've mentioned GPS quite a bit. Why? Having GPS info on your video could be the difference between winning and losing your claim, or lawsuit.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/322...good-basic-model-but-grab-the-gps-add-on.html

But if your video clearly shows the other vehicle at the time of the incident, why should GPS make that big of a difference? It seems it would add just one more helpful piece of evidence, but shouldn't necessarily be all that important.
(I realize that legal standards differ widely depending on country & region. I'm assuming the review article was written with US readers particularly in mind.)

 

[Nigel]

Not convinced that it is often much use for either claim or lawsuit!

The data is not guaranteed to be accurate and would be quite easy to fake, or modify, and in any case everything it gives you can be worked out in other ways from the video, and the video would be considerably more difficult to fake.

However it is useful, it keeps the clock set correctly to within a few seconds, if you use a dashcam video viewer then it helps to quickly locate the correct piece of video. It provides an easy way for you to check your speed, and while the instantaneous figure is not guaranteed to be correct, it is a good guide without having to put a lot of effort into calculating it from the video images. Being able to check your speed is useful for improving your driving habits.

It may also be quite useful to the police if they are trying to map out the journey taken by a car that several dashcams have seen, if they are all using GPS clocks to timestamp the video then they have accurate times for the journey. They are unlikely to bother except in a murder investigation, but then it could be very useful. Also if I send some video of a dangerous driver in to the police with a complaint, my GPS speed showing at the speed limit and a BMW passing at obviously 30+ mph faster means they can send the BMW owner some license points and a fine, wouldn't work in USA but it does here, needs to be a significant speed difference, but without the GPS speed they are very unlikely to take the time to calculate it from the video.

So for an extra $5 to $10 it is well worth it, if they are charging $30 extra, they just see it as a way to take your money!

 

[kamkar]

They would probably attain speed from distance in time ( from video footage ) between 2 points they can go measure the exact distance in between.
Your speed i assume ( in America ) could probably be used to argue, well if you dident go 5 MPH over the limit that guy running a red light and T-bone you would not have hit you.
While America and Denmark are the best friends ever, and much alike, there are also vast differences in between us on many points, even ones we share like democracy and being a society with a law that should apply to all that live there.

Few years ago a American was run over ( and killed ) on a street in our capitol by a small electric street sweeper machine malfunctioning due to poor maintenance, pretty sure the family did not cash in or get any money for that.
Same place more recent some punks going way too fast on jet skis in the harbor over there lost control and also killed a American ( exchange student i think,,,, and maybe it was 2 ) anyway i am sure they got nothing but a " we are so sorry"
And punk probably got a slap on the wrist. ( google say he got 2 years prison, outright murder get you at least 12 years here, they tried to slam him for 4 years )
If any above did get any money, i am very sure it would be peanuts compared to what you could get for similar cases in the US.

You can in cases be liable for compensation, but not a cash pay out as such, but if you dont sweep snow on your sidewalk in winder and someone fall, you will probably have to pay what ever that person loose in income ( which are not much as sick leave here at least for the first 3 months or so are 100 % of your paycheck )
In general if Danes get money or have to pay money say you hurt someone if a traffic accident, your mandatory insurance are supposed to pay, but some things they can of course deny to pay for.

As i kid in my first job i got 0 DKkr for loosing about 10 mm of a finger, where others getting similar minor damages get paid something at least...... Strange place this little old country.
And it was not the litigation, my dad did the "trial" and he was one of the foremost union bosses here, with decades of experience doing that for his union members, but i got a letter after a year or so saying i should not bother those guys with mundane injuries.

 

[jokiin]

yet another affiliate link review

 

[Nigel]

Jon L. Jacobi is fairly consistent in his dash cam reviews, GPS is good for legal use, but then says that he isn't aware of any cases where it was needed:

The Dash Cam Mini lacks GPS, which renders it slightly less than optimal for legal use and documenting travels. Granted, just the video of the accident has been sufficient in all the legal cases I’m aware of. But no GPS, in combination with a super-capacitor that provides a mere second or two of run time off the 12-volt, means it’s not the dash cam I’d recommend for bullet-proof legal protection.

It is difficult to work out if he is being positive or negative about a camera, or just trying to find something to write about:

The Nextbase 422GW is rated for use from 14 to 120 degrees, which is good enough for most climates. The unit runs warm to the touch, and a bit warmer still when connected to the phone. However, the thermals are not worrisome, and given the overall build quality, I’d expect the dash cam to outlive the one-year warranty.

- should be read as very negative, it will probably last the one-year before dying, but he was trying to keep Nextbase happy.

Viofo has done it again. The A129 Duo is easily our favorite budget dual-camera dash cam, and it holds its own against far more expensive duos from Thinkware and Blackvue. Aside from the somewhat unwieldy rear cam cable, it’s all goodness, all the time.

- definitely positive.

 

[Paul Iddon]

My 2 old NB cams are both still working - the 412 (with someone else now) from Aug 2016, and the 612GW from Oct 2017...

And of course the 522GW currently.

 

[Nigel]

My 2 old NB cams are both still working - the 412 (with someone else now) from Aug 2016, and the 612GW from Oct 2017...

And of course the 522GW currently.

I think the climate and sun power in Preston is a little different to San Francisco, much better for a battery based dashcam!

 

[Paul Iddon]

Hahah, it's pretty hot just now..

 

[Nigel]

Hahah, it's pretty hot just now..

And only 13 degrees C in San Francisco!

But it is still night time there, and at 37 degrees north instead of 54 the sun is definitely a lot stronger.

 

[woorich]

yet another affiliate link review

Sorry, but I don't understand what point you are making. Please clarify.

 

[jokiin]

Sorry, but I don't understand what point you are making. Please clarify.

if you click to buy from the link on their page they get a commision from the purchase, it leads to reviewers being nicer about what they review, it's a business

 

[woorich]

if you click to buy from the link on their page they get a commision from the purchase, it leads to reviewers being nicer about what they review, it's a business

Ah ok. I had thought you were implying that I should not have posted the link to the article, but it's poor form to quote someone without providing a link to the source.

 

[jokiin]

Ah ok. I had thought you were implying that I should not have posted the link to the article, but it's poor form to quote someone without providing a link to the source.

no sorry, didn't mean you were doing anything wrong, apologies if that was misunderstood

 

[SawMaster]

The GPS devices used in dashcams is notoriously cheap and slow to update, but might help prove a steady speed. This can usually be figured out from the video without a GPS so that benefit is of questionable value. Similar goes for location purposes, the cam video alone will almost certainly show exactly where you were. It's probably not going to help you with fighting a radar-confirmed speeding ticket, and it does generate a little more heat in the dashcam where excessive heat is already an issue for many of us.

I guess there's some academic value to this thread- I would find such statistics somewhat interesting- but IMHO the answer is pretty clear from the start that there's not much other benefit in having GPS in your dashcam so I doubt it would make much or any difference in litigation.

Phil

 

[Nigel]

It's probably not going to help you with fighting a radar-confirmed speeding ticket

Radars are not always accurate, so if you appeal a radar based speed ticket, and your GPS says you were not speeding, and a quick view of the video appears to show normal speed, and your video timestamp is accurate and matches the speed camera timestamp, then it is quite likely the person looking at the appeal will just cancel the ticket rather than get forensics to analyse the video with all the time and money that would involve.

Of course that only works if you drive within the speed limit, in which case it is unusual, but not unknown, to get a radar based speed ticket.

 

[jokiin]

police radars are calibrated on a regular basis, GPS are not calibrated, you won't beat a ticket based on that alone, if video shows someone else travelling faster than you were at the time you might get lucky

 

[lacibaci]

For me, the greatest advantage of GPS module is the accurate date/time, I would not buy a dash cam without it.

 

[comadose]

More useful when there are accusations of speeding. You can demonstrate easily that you were not speeding.

 

[Deleted member 46308]

police radars are calibrated on a regular basis, GPS are not calibrated, you won't beat a ticket based on that alone, if video shows someone else travelling faster than you were at the time you might get lucky

Attorney fees, forensic analysis, expert witnesses, depositions; the net results would be in the thousands versus a couple of hundred for a speeding ticket that you are going to pay one way or another. I would probably try not to speed and pay the fine if I did exceed the speed limit. GPS is a novel idea for defending against a speeding ticket, and is probably not going to help much versus a well-funded prosecutorial system like is present in the US. As @jokiin points out: maybe you get lucky, who knows

 

[Nigel]

Attorney fees, forensic analysis, expert witnesses, depositions; the net results would be in the thousands versus a couple of hundred for a speeding ticket that you are going to pay one way or another. I would probably try not to speed and pay the fine if I did exceed the speed limit. GPS is a novel idea for defending against a speeding ticket, and is probably not going to help much versus a well-funded prosecutorial system like is present in the US. As @jokiin points out: maybe you get lucky, who knows

Doesn't sound like you have a good justice system!

If you have some evidence to show the ticket is invalid then that evidence should be considered, and it shouldn't cost you anything as long as your claim is valid. Calibrated professional radar against consumer GPS might not be a good match, but GPS backed up with working out the speed from the video should win.

In UK it is known that radar is not always accurate, so the police only use lasers these days. The radar speed cameras are validated by photo evidence of the vehicle passing over lines on the road. So an appeal based on your GPS will get the photo evidence checked and if you were not speeding then the ticket will be cancelled at no cost to you.

Of course if you were speeding then forget it, the GPS will not help!