Mount to reduce In Car Camera Shake?

Chromatic

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Hey guys,

I have a Canon HF R500 .. Not a bad Mid Grade Cam,.. and I use it mostly in my car.. on a Gecko Dual suction cup mount. (Love that mount).

However, I get WAY too much camera shake.. I've tried everything with settings, moving mount all over the car.. and nothing helps.

So.. I'm reaching out for ideas. Is there a mount that will reduce drastically camera shake?

The camera has good Digital image stabilization (as good as it gets "digitally) anyway.. and several options of it.. powered, dynamic, intelligent, and so on. I did a lot of research on Cam corders and went through a few before settling on this Canon HF R500.. (This is *not* my primary dash cam.. I am going Mobius for that).. but I use this a lot for in car filming.. of devices in the car.. to just filming through windshield .. and so on. The shake really disappointing me and I'm at my wits end of where to go next. I don't want to buy $50 mounts just willy nilly.. as I don't have tons of money to blow trial and error. I thought the Gecko mount would do well.. and it's def. a solid mount.. and I like having it, but it's not forgiving on image stabilization.

I drive a Nissan 2008 350Z.. so it is a sports car, but I've seen plenty of setups that have minimal shake, so it's possible.. I just need some help with the right mount, or other ideas.

Any and all advice is appreciated, and I've done tons of research on this but need some direction, hopefully from personal experience to help me get something that will help.

Thank you for reading,
 
There is 2 ways to go about fighting the jello effect in footage.

1. have a extremely stiff Mount so that the camera shake in tune with car
2. have a Mount with vibration damping proberties, this is used a lot with quadcopters, normally its just 4 rubber grommets that insulate the camera from the vibrations of the quadcopter.

Just googled your Mount, and from looking at it seem to be quite solid, do you get the jello effect when recording at both 30 and 60 FPS ?
 
Yes forgot that try turning IS off, some times systems like that is just too smart to be true.

You might allso want to try adding a Little weight to the camera to see in that make it harmony better with the other components in play. ( easy nocost fix )
 
Turn the image stabilisation off and use a solid mount

I will turn off image stabilization.. Is my mount not considered a solid mount?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/B0023ZK2TY
I tried to research to get a solid one..

There is 2 ways to go about fighting the jello effect in footage.
1. have a extremely stiff Mount so that the camera shake in tune with car
2. have a Mount with vibration damping proberties, this is used a lot with quadcopters, normally its just 4 rubber grommets that insulate the camera from the vibrations of the quadcopter.

Just googled your Mount, and from looking at it seem to be quite solid, do you get the jello effect when recording at both 30 and 60 FPS ?

The mount I have linked above.. Seems quite solid.. And the shake is both the car and some camera movement compensation. But, the majority of the problem is what the car does.. at a standstill it's perfect.. but even just 5mph it's this slight , but quick, up and down jutter than makes it very hard to make out what I'm filming. IE: Say I'm filming the radar detector for testing and I have the mount back on the rear hatch (so it's not just right up on it focally).. it shakes up and down (perhaps some side to side) where the unit , well, shakes and you can't compensate for it like our eyes do naturally.

Is there a way I can modify this mount? Or is there a mount I can buy that will eliminate this jutter?

I have not recorded at the 35Mbps 60 FPS mode.. I will try that now.. and see if it makes a huge difference. I'll turn off all image stabalization.. it has Intelligent Stabilization, Dynamic Stabilization, and Powered Stabilization.. though none of these really do anything helpful for my situation. This is with the camera zoomed out as much as possible not zoomed in.. and at least 6 feet from what I'm shooting/videoing.

There must be a way to fix this, as I've seen the same car on a race track camera mounted on the rear hatch.. and the video was literally like there were zero bumps .. which is not possible with the tight suspension of this car, and this guy was on a track pushing it as hard as possible.. well into triple digits, around sharp hairpins etc..

I appreciate all tips, advice, links etc.. I'm going to give the no stabilization (which I've tried already.. on or off seems to produce the same results).. but I have NOT done the 60FPS as the bandwidth usage was so high.. but if it really helps this then I can and will use it.

The car is a Nissan 2008 350Z if that makes any difference..

Thanks for the ongoing tips!
 
When using that Mount, witch to me seen to be a solid one. you might want to have that "long" arm in a vertical position so that the camera either hang or stand on that arm ( if you catch my drift )

Could you possible make some pics of where you have the Mount / camera sittingin the car, i am a Little perplexed to how you have it installed.

If you use the zoom my experience tell me it just seem to make Things worse, the more zoom is used the more pronounced the shake seem to be.

Using 60 FPS should have some effect on the footage, the jello comes of Things ( vibrations Vs FPS) beeing out of tune, kinda like tuning a guitar if you ever tried that, you will hear when you hit the sweet spot.

You might want to try the Gecko dual Mount in this short config to stiffen Things up.
delkin_fat_gecko_dual_suction_cup__13293.1354902876.1280.1280.jpg


"I have the mount back on the rear hatch" is your car with folding roof or somthing like that ? if so you might allso want to try the Mount on the rear window with the roof up. ( just a wild guess here )
 
Lexus LS... squash vibration at its source... your car's suspension. :)
 
Well i dont know about that, with Danish taxes you will have to be a millionare or close to buy a car like that

Prize in 2008 for Nissan 350Z 3.5 V6 300HK Pack Roadster 6M/T = 669000 Dkkr or 122724 dollars with todays Exchange rate. :eek:

I dont undestand why you have these issues, the Mount seem solid and the camera is about 300 grams / 4-5 Oz i guesstimate.
But even with a rock hard sports car suspension it should Work in my eyes.

Wonder if the issues allso is there when the setup is monted off the windscreen, the damm cant be made of old coke Cans is it ? :D

Bless you Lucky Americans, dirt cheap cars and dirt cheap gasoline. :cool:
 
I tried the 60FPS image stab off.. it's just as bad, zero improvement. Zoomed in, zoomed out.. and zoomed only to show the outside of the car (ie: no foreground interior to show shake).. It's bad.

I will try shortening the gecko mount.. as I can reproduce the shake by hitting the mount with my hand over and over sitting still.. so it's coming through the vibrations of the car, to mount to camera. It's a good camera.. I did my research to get good stuff, just bad result.

And.. I've owned a Lexus LS.. lol.. I've had this 2008 350Z 6 months now.. and I LOVE it.. have put countless hours into modifying it.. there is no way it's going. And, yes the suspension is tight.. I don't want a squishy sedan suspension on a sports car.. defeats the purpose :) -- I've seen plenty of video of cams (nothing special) in the same car.. with even stiffer aftermarket suspensions as I mentioned and it's rock solid.. So I don't know.

I'd sell the Camera on ebay.. for a loss.. and get another camera that handled movement shake VERY well.. but not sure what that is. The Gopro is so limited.. I want the camera to also have manual focus controls and such.. as I will have a dash cam in the car as soon as I can afford it. This camera is fine for what it's designed to do.. be on a tripod, or hand held .. but attached to a moving object, not so much.

I thought surely there would be some special camera mounts that eliminated like 90% of the bumps, vibrations and such from driving out there on the market.

Thanks for the help so far.. and I'll take some pics of setup for you.. but it's just that Gecko mount put on rear hatch (look up 350Z and you'll see the rear hatch.. it's a big window).. I've put it on the passenger side window... and on the windshield itself. The windshield is slightly better because it doesn't vibrate AS much.. but it's still very very shaky. If you guys need footage examples of the shake I can edit those and throw them on youtube.. but trust me when I say it's too much shake .. so much so it's hard to watch without bugging your eyes.

There must be something to eliminate this shake.. and it can't be done with the camera apparently, so only thing left is a mount setup. Ideas?
 
Its really wierd you have to fight this problem, googeling the Mount there is pics of it with all manors of cameras mounted all over cars.

You might allso want to try borrow another camcorder, maybe somthing in the lens assembly is Loose on your camera.

If the top gear Guys can get decent footage from cameras mounted all over supercars and the like, it should be possible to do the same in a Nissan 350.

Have you tried the gear in another car ? wife or friends, could be fun to see if the issue is present there too.
 
Kakmar:

I actually thought the same.. and sent the Camera back to the shop, and had a brand new Camera.. same model.. sent to me.. Same issue. So the camera is operating as intended.

It's the bumps and how the camera handles these via the Car, Mount, to camera itself.

You are right.. many others don't have the issue like I do.. so it seems a touch odd. I had a JVC before this.. and it did the same thing. The constants are the car and the mount. I know car is in pristine condition .. as I'm a "shadetree" mechanic with a lot of knowledge, but it's just not my profession and have several master mechanics who have specifically adjusted and looked at the suspension several times since I've bought it. (This was brought up because the 350's are known to have an alignment issue with Toe in/Toe out, camber etc that causes the front tires to have feathering issues (uneven wear).. ) -- This was the first thing I addressed and fixed on the vehicle.

I really can't afford another camera.. I would happily sale this camera (it's literally less than a month old since I switched it out for a brand new one) .. but It's a $300 camera (and I have $100+ in accessories) .. but I'd likely get oh.. $200 or so on Ebay.. at best, and I'd have to know the camera I was going to get in place of it definitely would eliminate the issues.


IE: It wasn't a mount issue and so on.

Do they just not make a mount that dampens out vibrations for my purpose? The camera mounts on the standard screw all cameras do.. I figured worst case scenario I could buy a second mount for $50-$100 that was made to dampen all the jutters, shakes, bumps, vibrations, etc from the car to give a solid picture.

I need to take pictures of my setup for you guys.. I will do that tonight. I should also make a short clip of the vibration and throw it on youtube to you show you just how it looks.. though I'm sure most of you know what I'm speaking of fairly well.

I appreciate your ongoing help.. and if you have any mounts that would do the trick, even if a little pricey like $100.. I'd still like to look at them. I'm going to go try shortening that arm on the Gecko mount I have like someone suggested to try to see if it makes any difference at all (if the mount will do it.. )

Thanks
 
Here's a dash cam video shot during Hurricane Earl with a Canon HF200 and a Fat Gecko mount. Seems reasonably stable. Maybe you just need to try a different mount.....or let some air out of your tires. :) Actually, I'm leaning towards the theory that it's the camera that's the problem.

 
Here's a video clip I just rendered up of the shake.. This is actually in a bit more stable location off the passenger window.. but it shakes nonetheless wherever I put it. You see I need the devices that are center frame (I do have this zoomed in via my editor a bit.. just to pinpoint the area I really need to be more steady.. I understand it's unlikely to be perfect.. but this is just far from what it should/could be imo.

As for letting air out of the tires.. Nope, can't do that. I run them at 35PSI, factory specs -- and yes, this is a sports car,.. and the suspension isn't helping things, but like I've said you can go on youtube and randomly choose 350Z videos and find plenty that are much steadier.

As for the camera.. man, that's the route I can't afford. Not sure what I can get for this 3 week old camera. (It's actually one I bought 2 months ago .. + or - a few weeks).. that I had replaced with a completely new camera a few weeks ago, retail. Not manufacturer refurbished, but brand new. It may have a few hours use on it at best.

I put $400+ into the Canon HF R500 -- and it works wonderfully for a handheld, or tripod model, but so far, for inside a car .. just not working great.

I know I'll take a hit on it,.. but I can't keep it and get another.. So I'd have to sell it via Ebay unless someone else would like to get a brand new great Canon HFR500 with all the extended battery backs, tripod, external light attachment, accepts external microphone, AV port, touchscreen, larger CMOS, and on the list goes for a discount.

If there isn't a mount I can buy that will eliminate this stuff,.. then camera is next - But this has to be the final camera.. and it's price range needs to be somewhere in the $200 range.. the less the better.. IE: If I could get say $250 from this brand new $300 Canon HFR500 -- I'll sink all $250 back into another camera for MY purposes gladly.. Just don't have the funds to buy the new cam and have this one on the backburner to sell.

If it is Indeed the camera, then it is just the canon HF R500 is not a good camera for moving motion on a static mount,.. like in car filming.. Though it is advertised good for backpacking, skiing, and other fast movements.. has high speed settings for such..

I'm ask you guys, the experts. ;)

I tried to shorten the Gecko Dual Suction mount like was mentioned above, and I took it completely apart with my impact gone (took some force) and it would need another shorter bar that went in that place against the base of the mount. It just won't convert into a shorter mount with the pieces that are on it.

So

1) Car stays the same. No air is removed lol.. This is a tight independent suspension 350Z , modified and tuned self built car (on the mods and fab) --

2) I thought surely there was a mount out there for this very purpose that had high anti-dampening properties .. perhaps was a little bulky with it's design, shrug.. but it got the job done.. but I haven't found IT yet.. Thought maybe you guys would have an idea.

3) If this is the $300 Canon HF R500 (I researched and researched to find.. having to get one pricier that had larger CMOS, lens, etc in the body to be able to handle low light.. (wasn't focusing on camera shake at the time.) -- That is the main culprit in taking all these vibrations, bumps, etc and being horrible at keeping them still.. Then I don't have an option but to sale it and get another camera.

So thoughts? (aside from put it in a non sports car) << Defeats the purpose of the videos ) :)

Is there a mount that will fix this ? Even if it's a maybe.. give me some approved links.

If it's absolutely just a camera that's never going to handle this vibration.. Then some recommendations for other cameras that are in the $200 price range (cheaper is better.. but I understand you often get what you pay for..)

That said.. I initially bought a JVC $199 camera from Walmart that seeemed to be a little better on this shake (non immensely, but a little) but my needs were to have the ability for an external mic and the ability to record well in low light.. so sold the JVC and ended up with this Canon HF R500. So ,like the Mobius is a great action cam that has turned into a perfect dash cam.. maybe there is another relatively inexpensive camera that would suffice for this type of subject matter.

So,.. if camera you think 100%: Please give names, models, links of them,.. that you know will handle an exact scenario like the above video on that same mount and make it like so much better.

And again, if a mount exists that would fix this issue: Please throw them at me.. names,. models, links..

Thanks for all your input!
 
Ummm,............the suggestion to let air out of your tires was a tongue-in-cheek joke. Hence the smiley face. ;)
 
Ummm,............the suggestion to let air out of your tires was a tongue-in-cheek joke. Hence the smiley face. ;)

Yeah, I figured as much. My response wasn't trying to be too serious about that remark. Though you never know, some people would legitimately give you an answer like that as a true solution ;) -- Without realizing the implications it has on treadwear, traction, mpg, etc.

I'm still working on the issue --

Let me approach it from a different point of view.

Two things.

Price range $250 or less :

I if were to buy a completely different camera -- what would you recommend that would eliminate this problem for me? In that price range.. (cheaper the better of course). I keep this range, because even though this is a $300 body and new.. I doubt I'd get more than $250 for it..

Does anyone feel comfortable enough with any cameras they'd say if you buy Camera X, you'd be happy with the results?

Secondly..

Mounts: Not buying another camera -- Are there any other mounts, that likewise.. you guys would say.. Get Mount X,.. and it will clear up your issue .. Price on this .. oh $100 or less (give or take).

The above is just to see if anything exists that people agree on .. or not so much.
 
Found this randomly online:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/131177891278
Has an OPTICAL zoom.. and all features I need..

But leary, it's no brand.. But, sometimes you get stuff from Asia that's awesome.. my rear view back up camera I bought for 19$ and it's the same camera as the Kenwood $300 version.

Thoughts?
 
To add to Jokiin's comments, despite the claim on the eBay offering it is unlikely to have an optical zoom.

Edit: further review of the eBay link reveals that it states that this is an SJ4000 as offered here by FoxOffer.
 
I didn't read the listing but yeah no optical zoom on those, when descriptions are blatantly wrong I generally take that as a sign that it's a seller you should avoid
 
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