Need Cam with all the Options for a Single Work Truck

[DowneyDigs]

I own a small business and have one employee driving a pickup truck roughly 30 hours a month to read utility meters. The rest of the time, I drive this same truck operating a small utility company. I do a lot of driving, a lot of stopping in the road or on the shoulder, a lot of pulling in and backing out of driveways, and deal with all kinds of people and their dogs. I have been looking for a few months trying to find a cam that does what I need/want.
I think what I’m looking for is basically a full blown fleet management system, but for a single vehicle. I want a cam to automatically power on and record video from the front and rear any time the key is on or in accessory mode (cam inside the cab and/or on the sides would be a nice bonus). I also want it to have GPS, be able to tell the vehicle speed, and have some form of geofencing. That having been said, I’d like to be able to access at least the location and vehicle state (speed, stopped, etc) data remotely and in real-time. I would like to receive alerts when the vehicle crosses a virtual geofence. In other words, the cam would need to be cellular enabled to report this data back to a web portal so I can view it remotely via PC or Smartphone. I know I can buy separate devices to do all of these things, but there are so many options for each that it is overwhelming. I figure that if there are devices that do it all, the overall investment will probably be less and that will help narrow down my options.
I am hopeful that I can find a single solution that will help me to keep my employees honest and will help to document any accidents or incidents for insurance and/or legal purposes. Not looking to spend a fortune, but I expect a couple/few hundred dollars and a monthly cellular subscription.

Thank you in advance for any help.

Edit: It will be subjected to high temperatures in the summer, as I live in the south. Vehicle is frequently parked in direct sunlight for extended periods, is never garaged, and the air conditioner is not the best.

Edit 2: I do not have internet access or WiFi. I am in a very rural area with no internet access. Have excellent AT&T LTE cellular service though.
I do not care about the cam itself having a viewer, nor do care about watching video remotely and/or live. Would be nice to have an option where I can send a command for a still photo of the current view, but not required. Also, it would be nice to be able to connect via Bluetooth and use a smartphone as a viewer if this is an option.

 

[kamkar]

High temperatures are not a problem with a good camera,,,,, unless you expect to be recording meanwhile ( parking guard )
As far as i know there are none of the smart dashcams that have the option for a sim card, so they have to piggyback of the owner / drivers phone.

I am not well versed in those smart cameras ( blackvue and thinkware ) it seem like the stuff are not mature and throw all kinds of curb balls at people.

 

[DowneyDigs]

High temperatures are not a problem with a good camera,,,,, unless you expect to be recording meanwhile ( parking guard )
As far as i know there are none of the smart dashcams that have the option for a sim card, so they have to piggyback of the owner / drivers phone.

I am not well versed in those smart cameras ( blackvue and thinkware ) it seem like the stuff are not mature and throw all kinds of curb balls at people.

Kamkar1,
Thank you for your reply. Very good information.

I don’t think I have a need for parking mode, but not 100% certain. Honestly, I did not know that this capability existed until recently. I live in a rural area, so I am not parked in busy public areas except for when I have to go into town. Also, not a lot of vehicle theft or burglary in my area.
Very disappointing that there is not an option that will accept a SIM card and serve as a self contained wireless unit. An external hotspot would not be an option.
Now that I know all of that, are there any recommendations for a cam that would meet all of the other specifications? There are so many options that it is truly overwhelming to someone with no knowledge of dash cams. Also, is anyone familiar with wireless vehicle tracking devices, or familiar with another forum where I may could get some information?

 

[kamkar]

It will probably be there soon as the "smart" route seem to be what a few of the larger brands walk.
But it is a little problematic, these suckers generate about +100 MB of footage every minute they record, so if you are going to backup every days driving you will need a beefy data plan and a fat NAS to store the data on, not least if you have a little fleet.

There are some PRO equipment around that do allow for SIM card, but mainly meant for bus and larger vehicles.
Also most dashcams are not really tamper proof, so at any time your camera could get formatted or lens turned so it just film the dash, at least thats how it is with consumer grade cameras we focus on in here.

Denmark got pretty good 4G coverage as we are just a little speck on the world map, and the country are pretty flat, still driving around you will often find yourself in 3G area, and there are also black holes on the coverage map where people having a house just got to have a land line phone as they have no service on their smart phones.

This should be fixed with the soon to arrive 5G network, and gooberment deciding that all Danes must have 100 mbit at least, and if not fiber then 5G, so tax payer money will be thrown at this too now that there are no more bridges or tunnels to be build.

 

[abarth]

i don't know of one device that will do all that you want. i can however recommend an automatic PRO for GPS tracking, diagnostics, geo-fencing, fuel and expense tracking. have a read on the thread i wrote up about it. and let me know if you have any questions, i'll be glad to answer them.

i'm sure everyone else will have recommendations on cameras.

 

[DowneyDigs]

i don't know of one device that will do all that you want. i can however recommend an automatic PRO for GPS tracking, diagnostics, geo-fencing, fuel and expense tracking. have a read on the thread i wrote up about it. and let me know if you have any questions, i'll be glad to answer them.

i'm sure everyone else will have recommendations on cameras.

That pretty much checks all of the boxes for a tracking device.

Is it a self-contained wireless device, or do you have to sync it with a cell phone? In other words, does it connect directly to cell network without any additional hardware?

If it is self-contained, does it use gsm (AT&T) or cdma (Verizon) network? I’ve searched for these answers but am not finding anything.


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[abarth]

That pretty much checks all of the boxes for a tracking device.

Is it a self-contained wireless device, or do you have to sync it with a cell phone? In other words, does it connect directly to cell network without any additional hardware?

If it is self-contained, does it use gsm (AT&T) or cdma (Verizon) network? I’ve searched for these answers but am not finding anything.


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it does have it's own SIM card so it will communicate with cellular networks without another device in the middle.

I do not know which network it's on. I can tell you that it's never failed to give me real time updates...but that may not say a lot as I live in the SF bay area / silicon valley.

 

[DowneyDigs]

it does have it's own SIM card so it will communicate with cellular networks without another device in the middle.

I do not know which network it's on. I can tell you that it's never failed to give me real time updates...but that may not say a lot as I live in the SF bay area / silicon valley.

I’ll have to try to find an answer to that because AT&T and other GSM networks have great service in my immediate area while Verizon and other CDMA providers have no service at all.

I don’t see a 4G/LTE option for this product. Are you aware of a LTE option for the Automatic Pro? Otherwise, are you familiar with any other products that are 4G/LTE compatible?


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[abarth]

I’ll have to try to find an answer to that because AT&T and other GSM networks have great service in my immediate area while Verizon and other CDMA providers have no service at all.

I don’t see a 4G/LTE option for this product. Are you aware of a LTE option for the Automatic Pro? Otherwise, are you familiar with any other products that are 4G/LTE compatible?


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I don't know of any 4G devices like the automatic pro. I don't see a need for a higher speed 4G/LTE standard for a device like this. it's only transmitting minimal data for real-time tracking and diagnostic updates. I'm sure you can email support at automatic and let them know about your concerns and they'll let you know what networks they're using.

 

[DowneyDigs]

I don't know of any 4G devices like the automatic pro. I don't see a need for a higher speed 4G/LTE standard for a device like this. it's only transmitting minimal data for real-time tracking and diagnostic updates. I'm sure you can email support at automatic and let them know about your concerns and they'll let you know what networks they're using.

Finally found it:
“Automatic Pro connects to the Telefonica* network which piggybacks on AT&T / T-Mobile (and should be using whichever is stronger in a given area), which may be different than the network your mobile phone is connected to. Also, whereas most smartphones support LTE and many fallback bands, Automatic Pro is looking for a 3G (specifically, HSPA) connection. Thus it is possible that your phone may have LTE coverage where HSPA coverage is weaker. Why 3G and not LTE? Coverage and cost. There’s more 3G coverage in the nation, especially on long non-urban highway roads where long drives happen. Also, everything about 3G is cheaper than LTE which allows us to offer you a lower cost device without a subscription fee.”

My concern about 3G vs 4G/LTE was because I have been informed that 3G is in the process of being phased out.

My next question is about the data accuracy and retention. How much history is stored on the website? Can I rely on this device to provide accurate data, and can I use the website to track and log my vehicle mileage for tax purposes? Or would I still need to keep a handwritten mileage log?



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[DashOto]

AT&T and T-Mobile both have an ODB dongle that doubles as a wi-fi hotspot.
https://www.t-mobile.com/internet-device/t-mobile-syncup-drive
AT&T's website was harder to find, so you might want to contact them since it sounds like you are on AT&T already.
They probably have a plan where you can share your data between the ODB (or mobile hotspot if you want more freedom for wi-fi - removable, but easily hidable. Charges like a cellphone.)

Overall, from a glance over your needs, I think the Thinkware F800 Pro will meet most of your requests.
There is some nice bundles on Amazon that have the Front Camera and Rear Camera, hardwiring kit, and everything you need for install.

Here's Thinkwares website: https://www.us.thinkware.com/f800pro

 

[abarth]

My concern about 3G vs 4G/LTE was because I have been informed that 3G is in the process of being phased out.

My next question is about the data accuracy and retention. How much history is stored on the website? Can I rely on this device to provide accurate data, and can I use the website to track and log my vehicle mileage for tax purposes? Or would I still need to keep a handwritten mileage log?



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good point. new 3G devices are no longer being signed by major carriers. but if it's anything like the death of 2G...it'll take almost a decade.

location data has been pretty spot on for me as the device uses cellular and GPS. I don't know how far back the data is on their servers but I can say that the app still has my first trip on it (may 2018). I don't personally use it but each trip can be "tagged" as a business expense and you are likely able to download that in some form. I do however keep track of my fuel expenses and efficiency. the automatic app will read the vehicle's odometer and I have to manually input the cost and fuel volume as well as grade and fuel brand.

 

[kamkar]

I dont think older networks here get scrapped as such when a new technology get introduced, i still think we have the 2 and 3G too at least though 5G have finished testing and are about to go up at least from 1 carrier, but the other also nationwide carrier will also do the same.

I know when i drive out in the sticks i still have a connection but my phone dont always display 3 or 4G, and as i understand it the older tech have better reach than the newer but faster ( data ) connections, so it make sense to me to keep the old ones around.
If you had to cover the whole little country with 5G alone, you will have to put up a lot more masts.

 

[DowneyDigs]

Now that we know that I will need two separate devices, does anyone have recommendations for a dash cam without all of the other features? I think the cam should be pretty simple now, but that increases the number of options.

I guess I’m just looking for a 2 channel cam for front and rear view. Would like it to be hardwired. Should withstand high temperatures. Large storage capacity that will automatically overwrite oldest when full. Great day and night time video quality, and higher bitrate to handle shadows (lots of trees). Form factor should be on the smaller side (small truck) or be easily mounted behind the rear view mirror. Would like to use iPhone to view video and/or settings, but that is not required.

The tracking device will take care of the GPS and other requirements from my original post.

I do like the Thinkware F800 Pro that was recommended previously, but it has a lot of unnecessary features that drive the price up. Parking mode, gps, accident sensors and WiFi are no longer a requirement for my dash cam.



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[country_hick]

good point. new 3G devices are no longer being signed by major carriers. but if it's anything like the death of 2G...it'll take almost a decade..

I still use a small brick tracphone from around 9 years ago with actual buttons and a very small screen on top. The battery is still in great shape despite being left in the car all summer and winter.
I doubt I have charged it a dozen times yet.

 

[SawMaster]

I'm in upstate,SC, and I like to have cams that can run continuously in the summer heat here. While these are single channel cams, the original Möbius with supercaps, the newer B1W, and the WR-1 (which may be out of production) have held up well. The SG9665GC has a reputation for handling heat well too. Given your planned usage, this is the first thing you need to be looking for as most cams do not do well in the heat we get here.

Unless your employees are total dullards, they will notice a cam and likely mess with it. There's not a lot you an do about that if they have the intent to not be recording. The noncommercial dashcams we discuss here have no security features at all. For that, you'll have to get imaginative and DIY something which prevents tampering but does not impede the cooling airflow these cams need. Which will pique their interest even more. You may end up needing a commercial type cam, just saying.

If I were in your shoes, I'd use Möbius for a cam, gluing the mount solid once I had the aim correct, then securing the power cord and can to the mount using the zip-tie seals like you see on the trailer doors of semis. Then I'd make it clear to employees that any tampering is instant dismissal with any damages they cause to the cam coming out of their last paycheck. To the few who I allow to use my important power tools, they get the spiel: "If your stupidity hurts my tool you will pay for it and for any loss of work time that causes me. And you'll probably get fired too." Sems to work quite well!

Phil

 

[kamkar]

"If your stupidity hurts my tool you will pay for it and for any loss of work time that causes me. And you'll probably get fired too."

You brak it ! you buy it.

 

[SawMaster]

One sawblade can cost me $50 and I'm not using the expensive ones, so yeah, there has to be personal responsibility involved here.

Phil

 

[country_hick]

One sawblade can cost me $50 and I'm not using the expensive ones, so yeah, there has to be personal responsibility involved here.

Phil

Are those diamond blades?

 

[SawMaster]

Nope, just a blade for wood. Stupid gets costly quick in my business so you learn to avoid it.

Phil