Outside views of mounted dash cams

Jokin, I see and respect your point, but I see little difference as you still have a way of noting errors (led blinks or colors) and you can still format cards in-cam as long as you remember how to do it. Which I'll admit having forgotten how to do with my Mobius- I just bring that cam to my desk and use the GUI on the PC :p There's not a large difference to me, that's all.

Phil

totally understand where where you're coming from also, not every user is a power user and there are times when the simplicity of a screen and a couple of keys make life a whole lot easier for some people, if you took the support calls you'd maybe have a better understanding of how many people just don't get technology
 
These are the same people who have huge GPS units running when they don't need them and have entertainment screens going in the rear seats even when nobody is siting there to watch. They are trying to impress people because they are not otherwise impressive people. Look up "codpiece" in the dictionary and you'll understand why :p

Phil
 
not necessarily, just different people with different views
 
How come the police have speed cameras with a 'live' view of the road, I think it might be more illegal to obstruct the view of the driver if an accident occurs, or to distract the driver causing an accident i.e. sect 2 or 3 RTA 1972/1988. The driver should not be able to see the screen I agree, sect 109 of the 'Road Vehicle( Construction and Use )Regulations 1986,
109.—(1) No person shall drive, or cause or permit to be driven, a motor vehicle on a road, if the driver is in such a position as to be able to see, whether directly or by reflection, a television receiving apparatus or other cinematographic apparatus used to display anything other than information—

(a)about the state of the vehicle or its equipment;

(b)about the location of the vehicle and the road on which it is located;

(c)to assist the driver to see the road adjacent to the vehicle; or

(d)to assist the driver to reach his destination.

(2) In this regulation “television receiving apparatus” means any cathode ray tube carried on a vehicle and on which there can be displayed an image derived from a television broadcast, a recording or a camera or computer.

So I guess you could get away with an LCD/LED device? ;):D

I had this argument with a muppet on facebook the other week. he even said he was a retired cop!
Reckoned that satnavs and daschams were exempt as not classed as televisions, whereas a DVD player etc weren't. He went on to tell me that, in court, definition is everything.
I pointed out that, in court, a judge would simply open up his Oxford English dictionary & find the following "
television
ˈtɛlɪvɪʒ(ə)n,tɛlɪˈvɪʒ(ə)n/
noun
  1. 1.
    a system for converting visual images (with sound) into electrical signals, transmitting them by radio or other means, and displaying them electronically on a screen."
Which seems to me to describe EXACTLY the basic functions of a dashcam?
 
Which seems to me to describe EXACTLY the basic functions of a dashcam?
Only if it has WiFi.

I doubt very much that satnavs are specifically exempt under law. It's just no cop would have the bare-faced cheek to bring it to court unless one was demonstrably a contributory factor.
Dashcams are a slightly greyer area, but I still doubt anyone will ever be prosecuted for having one.

Definition is everything, but laws are lagging behind the times. Something we'll have to get used to as technology accelerates faster and faster.
 
Only if it has WiFi.

I doubt very much that satnavs are specifically exempt under law. It's just no cop would have the bare-faced cheek to bring it to court unless one was demonstrably a contributory factor.
Dashcams are a slightly greyer area, but I still doubt anyone will ever be prosecuted for having one.

Definition is everything, but laws are lagging behind the times. Something we'll have to get used to as technology accelerates faster and faster.
A cop could pull you if the screen on the cam was on & able to be viewed by the driver whilst driving.
Not necessarily WiFi...
"converting visual images (with sound) into electrical signals, transmitting them by radio or other means, and displaying them electronically on a screen.

Electricity is transmitted via wires from the power station to the householder.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/gcsebi...lectricity/transmitting_electricityrev1.shtml

Satnavs are exempt according to the wording of the rule "(d)to assist the driver to reach his destination."

The wording also implicates dashcams...
(2) In this regulation “television receiving apparatus” means any cathode ray tube carried on a vehicle and on which there can be displayed an image derived from a television broadcast, a recording or a camera or computer.
So, even before the CRT was outdated & replaced by plasma, LED or LCD or whatever the new tech will be tomorrow, the ruling covers it
 
Definition is everything, but laws are lagging behind the times. Something we'll have to get used to as technology accelerates faster and faster.

It has always been this way. And all it tends to do is confuse the issue when you have to describe in detail what is legal and what is not. By the time it gets sorted out something else has come along starting the process all over again. One law worded correctly could work for everything if Judges and Juries were sensible but that too is a problem; something like this perhaps:

"Nothing shall be placed within the drivers field of vision which impairs their view to a degree that creates an unsafe condition. In an event involving damages or the violation of road laws where view might have been so impaired it shall be presumed that view was impaired, but otherwise the presumption should be that view was not impaired unless obviously so."

No crash= no violation, but if a crash does occur then it matters. I had a small ratty pickup many years ago where I placed numerous bumper stickers on the rear window (and elsewhere). It would seem my rear vision was blocked but but was not as I had left space between them and I had good outside mirrors as well. I could even see a dog or cat in the rear equally well compared to having no stickers but that requires use of the outside mirrors too. To someone who primarily used the inside mirror it would have been a hazard, but to someone who compensated for it there was no such problem. I had to explain that to a couple Cops who saw my point was valid thus making my installations legal.

It should be about the effect, not a specific action, and as long as safety is not compromised there's no need to get specific unless you're a Lawyer trying to make money :p

Phil
 
Hmm... So does a dashcam "assist the driver to reach his destination"? :D You'd need a good lawyer to argue that.

Anyway, not much to see in my van, move along...

mount_nopol_4076.jpg


Maybe looking through a polarizing filter will make it clearer - it's to the left of the satnav (which is removed when I leave the van)...

mount_pol_4075.jpg

Normally the red plug of the USB cable is hidden away but I had to move it to the camera from the GPS mount.
 
Since when did a dashcam assist a driver to reach his destination? even loophole larry (or whatever his name is) couldn't argue that case.
 
It doesn't, not literally. Hence the smiley. But some people describe dashcams as a form of protection or safety feature (which again they aren't, not literally.) And we live in a world where facts are twisted and given perverse interpretations, and these falsehoods are sometimes accepted by the courts and even enshrouded in law. I can think of at least one example where the law requires companies to lie about a simple, basic fact.
 
A cop could pull you if the screen on the cam was on & able to be viewed by the driver whilst driving.
Not necessarily WiFi...
"converting visual images (with sound) into electrical signals, transmitting them by radio or other means, and displaying them electronically on a screen.

Electricity is transmitted via wires from the power station to the householder.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/gcsebi...lectricity/transmitting_electricityrev1.shtml

Satnavs are exempt according to the wording of the rule "(d)to assist the driver to reach his destination."

The wording also implicates dashcams...
(2) In this regulation “television receiving apparatus” means any cathode ray tube carried on a vehicle and on which there can be displayed an image derived from a television broadcast, a recording or a camera or computer.
So, even before the CRT was outdated & replaced by plasma, LED or LCD or whatever the new tech will be tomorrow, the ruling covers it
exception (c)

(c)to assist the driver to see the road adjacent to the vehicle; or

adjacent
əˈdʒeɪs(ə)nt/
adjective
  1. 1.
    next to or adjoining something else.
    "adjacent rooms"
    synonyms: adjoining, neighbouring (on), next door to, abutting, close to, near to, next to, by, close by, by the side of, bordering (on), beside, alongside, abreast of, contiguous with, proximate to, attached to, touching, joining.
    cheek by jowl with;
    "
 
I have noticed that nobody, company or member posts images of their cameras from outside the car. I am interested in this to show which camera is the least obvious to a potential thief. Any shots would be appreciated

If you look at some of the threads here on the subject of camera mounting you will find many examples of members posting outside views of their installations. Where did you mount your camera? Post your pictures has numerous examples. Mobius Mounting Solutions also offers many examples of outside windshield images of dash cam installs.

It's great to see these images posted as they are indeed helpful but the fact is that they don't really tell the full story. While certainly some cameras are far more stealthy than others, the visibility of a camera can change instantly and often constantly with the weather conditions, time of day and the lighting. Clouds reflected off the glass generally will obscure the view into a vehicle but, of course, direct sunlight will illuminate things. The same camera can also look more or less stealthy depending on the particular vehicle it is mounted in. One just needs to stand outside their vehicle, with or without a camera installed and note how well they can see inside their car - or not, on any given day or time of day. I have four rather stealthy cameras in my vehicle and they are often very hard to notice, yet sometimes under certain lighting, there they are plain as day. There is no way around it.

One thing I've learned in six years of dash cam ownership is that some cameras are immediately recognizable as cameras, while some don't register to the casual viewer if they don't know what they are looking at. For example, I have asked friends and acquaintances to look at the rear window of my vehicle where I have a Mobius camera discreetly mounted at the top of the glass that is otherwise still somewhat visible and tell me what they see. Most of the time people don't see it even if they are staring right at it, as it somehow doesn't immediately quite register as something they are familiar with as a camera. "Oh, I didn't see that!" is often the phrase I hear. Others sometimes say, "What is that?", after I point it out.
 
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While cameras with screens are user friendly, the screens are not used often, so one might say, set it up once on your computer and give me a dashcam without a screen so that it's not an eyesore. As long as the dashcam is reliable, and doesn't freeze, and indicates when there is an error and an external monitor can be hooked up easily. Better to carry a 5-7" LCD monitor somewhere tucked away in your car than have a 4" dashcam screen on your windshield.
 
exception (c)

(c)to assist the driver to see the road adjacent to the vehicle; or

adjacent
əˈdʒeɪs(ə)nt/
adjective
  1. 1.
    next to or adjoining something else.
    "adjacent rooms"
    synonyms: adjoining, neighbouring (on), next door to, abutting, close to, near to, next to, by, close by, by the side of, bordering (on), beside, alongside, abreast of, contiguous with, proximate to, attached to, touching, joining.
    cheek by jowl with;
    "
That's not an exemption for dashcams though, It's more to do with reversing cams or those used to monitor sides (blind spots) of large vehicles (when turning).
 
Yes I agree, but it doesn't state that, would be down to test cases, legal findings of past cases. Id wager dash cams were practically unheard of when the legislation was put in place, as per the cathode ray tube.:confused:
 
From outside, iTrue X3, Viofo A119, Taotronics TT-CD06 and Chupad D501:

IMG_20160927_172330642-dashcams.jpg

IMG_20160927_172340554-dashcams.jpg

IMG_20160927_172346297-dashcams.jpg
 
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