Petition the car manufacturers to incorporate dash cam systems.

erkme73

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...As much as I want the "wrong do-er" to be accountable for his or her own behaviour and actions, would the "wrong do-er" be compelled to provide their own dashcam evidence in a criminal or other legal situation?

You make an interesting point with that question. All I can think of is the 'black box' recorder that exists in all newer cars. After a crash, it will let authorities know if you were wearing your seat belt, what speed you were going at impact, whether you applied the gas or brakes, etc... I don't know if a warrant is required to access that data, but given that it is mandated, I would think the purpose is pretty obvious. Since it's OEM-installed (or .gov mandated), there's likely no way to contest its existence, or the right to refuse its surrender.

Once cameras become mandatory, OEM-installed equipment, my guess is, it would fall under the same evidentiary guidelines. Aside from all the great points brought up above, that alone would get me to vote no.
 

old4570

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Im amazed !
So many people DIE on the road , are maimed , crippled and mutilated ..
If it was the beach and Sharks were doing this to people ( carnage ) , sharks would be eliminated off the coast of the USA ..
THE USA Military would be patrolling in gunships and shooting anything that looked like a shark !

But because its the road and people ( idiots ) are doing this to each other , doing something to stop it is simply too hard .
They talk about guns all the time , but what about the other lethal weapon ? The Car !
And what about cigarettes ( the other lethal weapon ) .
It should be mandated by law that every car is fitted with a functioning dash camera ( yeah - turning it off would be a pinch ) ..
Why ? , because humans are idiots - that's why .. We all have our moment in the sun !
And when we have that moment , and cause harm to others it would be nice if its captured on Camera ..
They way , if you were driving like a homicidal douche bag - they can tack on premeditated attempted murder ( if you didn't succeed in killing some one ) ..
You know - earn bonus points like in Death Race 2000 ! ( A lot of people seem to drive like they were participating in that movie )
That way you can be removed from the excessive responsibility of being a member of society !
 

erkme73

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Im amazed !
So many people DIE on the road , are maimed , crippled and mutilated ..
If it was the beach and Sharks were doing this to people ( carnage ) , sharks would be eliminated off the coast of the USA ..
THE USA Military would be patrolling in gunships and shooting anything that looked like a shark !

But because its the road and people ( idiots ) are doing this to each other , doing something to stop it is simply too hard .
They talk about guns all the time , but what about the other lethal weapon ? The Car !
And what about cigarettes ( the other lethal weapon ) .
It should be mandated by law that every car is fitted with a functioning dash camera ( yeah - turning it off would be a pinch ) ..
Why ? , because humans are idiots - that's why .. We all have our moment in the sun !
And when we have that moment , and cause harm to others it would be nice if its captured on Camera ..
They way , if you were driving like a homicidal douche bag - they can tack on premeditated attempted murder ( if you didn't succeed in killing some one ) ..
You know - earn bonus points like in Death Race 2000 ! ( A lot of people seem to drive like they were participating in that movie )
That way you can be removed from the excessive responsibility of being a member of society !

Liberty and personal freedom carry risks. It's a tough nut for some people to crack. Using your logic, think about how many people are killed (or seriously injured) as a result of domestic abuse, child abuse, child molestation. We could stop all of these things if we just put cameras in every home. Right... doesn't sit so well when you look at it from that perspective. Cameras in cars are ok if the occupant chooses to install one. But once we make the argument that our privacy is no longer relevant because of the lives it could save, well... that's how we got the NSA.
 
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old4570

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Hmmm , not sure a Dash cam violates privacy , or liberty or freedom !
OK - it would probably violate some ones right to commit a crime unseen , to endanger life , etc . Bit only if some one sees the footage .
And the camera is pointed out , not in ..
+ When you drive , you do so in a public place where you have no right to privacy on account your in PUBLIC ! , using public roads , possibly endangering the public around you ..
SO as far as dash cams go , its a bit of a non issue ... You have to wear seat belts ? Fed gov has mandated safety standards ? are not all of these Violations of Liberty and freedom .. Like drink driving !
Should a car manufacturer not be free to build a death trap ? , or for States to build seriously dangerous roads .. Or drivers consume massive amounts of alcohol before and during the use of a car ? ( Liberty after all )
You see where Im going , I think people that are against dash cams ,,,,,, May have something to be afraid of , possibly their driving style . ( And so they should )
Im going with , you drive in public - on public roads - then you need to be cammed up ! So that if your a homicidal douche bag , hopefully the cam will earn you massive bonus points .
 

erkme73

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Can a seat belt record your actions, comments, or behavior? Ok, then admittedly, that's a poor comparison. I don't take issue with recording in public. I agree completely that if you're in public, you have no expectation of privacy. However, the cameras that may film me in public are static (CCTV, redlight cameras, passing motorists with dash cameras) - they're not tied to me, or my vehicle. Once they're tied to a person or car, they are essentially a tracking device. They record not just what's happening in public, but the are creating a record of where you go, where you've been, who you were with, how long you were at a particular place...

Some odd things like, going to a strip club, an abortion clinic, a gay bar, an adult book store, a psychologist's office, an AA/NA meeting, a Mosque, a protest, headquarters for the current political opposition party... you get the idea. Sure, it's mundane, boring stuff. But it's MY stuff. And I don't necessarily want that information privy to the car maker or their stooges.

I understand the desire to want to lower crash statistics and punish bad drivers, but if mandating cameras in every vehicle means the potential for our privacy to be compromised to this extent - we are one huge step closer to Orwellian's 1984. If that doesn't scare you, why not mandate body cameras on everyone to cut down on murder? Still struggling to see the liberty/privacy issue?
 
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old4570

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You must be talking GPS tracking ! ( Im not )
I just want cars cammed ... ( Video footage of whats in front of the car )
Data logging ( info added to the video footage ) ?
As for sending GPS data to a Gov agency VIA some sort of mobile link , hell no ...
And why would you park @ a strip club ? . What if your wife or GF finds out ( ok maybe they are OK with that ? )
If your that worried about anyone knowing . ??????????
If you use a Fpos or credit card there , the bank the Gov will know in anyway ..
We all know that the Gov collects this sort of data - right ?
So if you love your credit card or Fpos card , you must have no issue with the Gov knowing a heck of a lot about you .
No wonder Governments want cashless society ...
That way they will know everything .... And control everything , imagine waking up to find some one had deleted your bank account - oooops !
 

erkme73

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A video record of where you drive is as good as GPS. To anyone who has access to your recorded video, they will know exactly where you've taken your car - and all the things that entails.

Of course I realize that all transactions are monitored. Why do you think there's a current push by all central banks to eliminate cash? Just because they have access to my banking and retail transactions doesn't mean I don't care about invading my privacy in other ways.

I've really grown tired of hearing statists claim, "well if you're not doing anything wrong, you've got nothing to hide". Well, yes, actually, I do have something to hide. MY PRIVACY.

When a device captures ALL of my travels, and that device is not under my exclusive control - that is, I cannot prevent the release of that data to others - that is a HUGE privacy issue. One that I would not surrender willingly. With that, you can have the last word.
 

old4570

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Hehehehehe , well ..
If you have committed a crime , the GOV ( police ) will get a warrant and put you through a microscope .. ( Thats life )
Same with the cam .. I would assume a warrant would be needed and then probable cause for the warrant ..
On the other hand if you have been caught red handed ( traffic offence ) , even then a warrant would be required to seize video footage ..
My only advice would be to use a small SD card , so only an hour or so is recorded ...

And if your that worried about privacy , I just dont know what to say ?
Except if some one really wants to know , there is little to nothing you can do about it ..
The feds are already testing Drones that can stay airborne all day way up out of eye sight , that have a sophisticated camera system that can record just about everything ..
All this info goes into a central data base , and they can go back to any time place that was recorded , and do a playback , they can track cars , people ..
If you think that a dash cam is violating your privacy , DUDE ! .. 5 to 10 years from now , forget about it .
There will be surveillance drones that see and record everything , hell we are there now !
You may wish to move to Alaska , build a log cabin , and prospect for some Gold or something to buy food with ..
But im sure a surveillance satellite will pass overhead on a regular basis keeping an eye on you ..
And apparently the cameras are so good now , they can read a news paper from space ( and that was maybe 20 years ago )

Any semblance of privacy you feel that you have , is an illusion !
And that is the sad fact of modern technology .
 
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I use dashcams because I'm a defensive driver. I have never caused vehicular collisions, and I have experienced situations whereby the "Other Party" had different recollections of what had happened.

Regardless, human memory recollection is not perfect and is frequently unreliable. I can see where dashcams could resolve issues. Another thing to remember is that dashcam evidence could come from third-party recordings--from someone who is witness to rather than party to a collision or some situation.

It will be interesting to see how increased usage of dashcams impacts various special interest groups, whose revenue streams have relied on lawsuits, litigation, etc.

I could see more and more car manufacturers offering dashcams as an option, but I don't think the government should force it upon the marketplace.
 

old4570

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I think dash cams should be shoved down our throats !
To many people need a wake up call . TV commercials are not doing it , safe driving campaigns are not doing it , and if anything , people seem to be a lot worse now than say 10 years ago .
If this trend continues , the roads are going to be just like Death race 2000 ! ( Who the hell wants that ? )
People seem to think they have a right to drive dangerously !

Way back in the time machine , the Government forced car drivers to drive on one side of the road Violating freedom of choice !
They imposed speed limits Violating freedom of choice ,
They imposed drink driving laws Violating freedom of choice
The made people ware safety belts , Violating freedom of choice
They imposed tough standards on car manufacturers to make safer cars - Violating freedom of choice
They even imposed driver training - Violating freedom of choice

So obviously some one thought that some freedoms are bad for everyone !
Like the right to drive on which ever side of the road you want at any speed you want with as much alcohol in your system as you want !

I dont think a dash cam violates any rights , its simply a device that removes innuendo - speculation - and outright lies !
It is quite obviously a double edged sword , not only does it work for you , but it can equally well work against you . ( That truth thing )
So obviously if your a bad driver , you don't want evidence of such .
Never mind that you could adjust your driving style , perhaps be less aggressive , perhaps break fewer road regulations , or undertake driver education in an effort to be a better driver ...
I know , when it comes to driving its always the other guy , and one never makes mistakes . ( So one should be thumbs up for dashcam then ? )
Again , I think most places / countries / states would require a warrant to seize footage , so you probably got yourself in some deep do do for that to happen . ( Law enforcement to seize footage )

But I think with the surveillance upgrades most countries are contemplating for the future , we are arguing about nothing ! consequential .
Most states/cities will have the capability to capture almost everything on camera ..
Just try central London , its cammed to the hilt . Nothing happens and its not on cam .
Sure you can still be murdered , but you can take comfort in the HD video footage shown the following day on TV .. ( 5 o-clock news )
 

old4570

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My apologies - I forgot about the most obvious violation of Americans rights !
Traffic lights , so many people still refuse to obey traffic signals , believing it is their God given right to drive through a Red Light ( Stop Light )
Apparently these same people kick up a huge fuss every time Red light cameras are put up ! ( A violation of their civil liberties )



Yeah , those traffic lights are a Violation of ones freedom of choice .... The proof is in the pudding !
 
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David-ogopogodude

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Old4570, .. I totally agree with you and your comments. I, too, think that we ALL should have car dash cams shoved down our throats.

When I posted this topic, I knew there was going to be controversy. But this is good. We need to talk about an important issue.

In my humble opinion, once a person gets into a car, ... privacy is GONE. Period. The public roadways are NOW in use, ... because, now, ... this very act of a person getting into their vehicle, starting it, and putting the car's transmission into "D ", then we must throw privacy out the window (for safety's sake, and the protection of everybody (all drivers, pedestrians, and cyclists).
The only two reasons why a person does not want car dash cams to be mandated as a necessary item of a every new car is because of these two issues: 1/this particular person (that is anti-car-dash cam) has occasional bad driving habits & does not want to get caught or 2/ anything that is potentially mandated (or highly recommended) becomes a threat to their beliefs (sort of like vaccination/immunization shots).

Look, ... I speed all the time. Not excessively, but certainly above the speeding limit. Every day, actually. Also, I tend to roll thru stop signs etc (when there is no-one around like at 6 a.m. or 11:co pm). But the police & judicial system, are not out to crack down on this type of behaviour. This type of behaviour is really not the cause of accidents. Poor drivers are the problem. Some people just shouldn't be issued DL's. One thing that I know and that is that I am a VERY safe driver. I have never been in an accident that was my fault in 36 years of driving experience, with more than 1.4 million miles logged. In addition, I never put anybody's lives at risk. I just don't, .. not even mine. I know what my boundaries & capabilities are, ... this is the key. The lousy drivers do not know the parameters of their abilities. This is what causes accidents.

I think that we at these forums agree on one thing: Car dash cams are a very good idea. This is why we are here talking about about them. We all want to protect ourselves.

It is also my own personal belief that a car dash cam should be in every vehicle, but that it can be voluntarily turned off, like some vehicles that have airbags that also can be turned off by the driver.

In any event, for a light hearted reprieve, one should go to YouTube and type in Jeff Jefferies (the comedian) + gun control. This video clip of his stand up comedy is so worth watching. I chose this because Jeff Jefferies is Australian and his accent sooooo enhances his comedy act. But a word of warning: your cheeks will be sore from laughing so hard.

 
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old4570

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Unfortunately this comedian is clue less !
There was a gun buy back , two of them actually ..
One for Semi auto rifles and one for handguns ..

The result was more guns , not less guns .. Unfortunately most anti gun people are clue less ..
There are more guns in criminal hands now , than at any time in Australia's history .
+ After the buy back , gun owners took that money and bought more guns .
So there were more registered ( legal ) guns after the buy back than before the buy back ..

So the Politically correct BS does not match the facts !

+ Most of this Gun stuff is related to mental disorder .. So in fact , with the decline in mental health care , there has been a corresponding increase in Mental cases doing stupid things with Guns .
So rather than giving these nut jobs the mental health care they need , they are either ignored or turned out on the street to cut costs ...
I just dont know what to say ..

A lot of the road stuff = Is mentally related as well , these people are crazy .. ( Yeah just watch YouTube )
So want to cut back on violence , do something about mental health .. ( Which in most countries around the world is in the too hard basket )
Blaming Guns for deaths , is like blaming cars for the road toll ...
Ban Guns = Ban Cars = Ban Alcohol = Ban Cigarettes = Ban Idiots

Dont let people take responsibility for their actions , blame inanimate objects ..
I dont blame cars when some idiot drinks and drives and kills a family of four ..

And this comedian - Is so full of **** its not funny !
Almost everything coming out of his mouth is horse **** .
I can't believe anyone would trust such a butt hole ...
I can't find this idiot funny at all , he is so stupid ( The comedian )
 

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Mobius x3, G1W held as spare.
I wholeheartedly believe that EVERY vehicle should have a dashcam in use - but the choice of cam should be down to the individual.
Car manufacturers should be providing proper 5v power supplies. They should also provide a few cubbys under the acres of dash whereby a satnav and/or mobile can be mounted so it is * viewable to the driver, * able to be charged from power points mounted inside the cubby, *provides secure storage for such devices and * not stuck in the stupidest of places on the windscreen.
For those who believe this might take away a right or a freedom - I do hope you remove the battery from your smartphone before setting off & that your car is ancient enough to not have any computerised gadgetry under the bonnet, or any airbags
 

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I for one was amused by him. Cracked up laughing whiling cleaning my Glock.
 
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David-ogopogodude

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MiiHere , ... now that is the kind of reply that is entertaining. Another hilarious standup comedian is a guy by the name of Brian Regan. I won't place the link but you can search him in YouTube Bar. This guy never swears, but is sooooo funny. (I find that I make the most use of YouTube by searching stand up comic acts).

By the way, I looked at the Corvette's incorporated PDR (personal data recorder) and it is pretty cool. I watched a clip on a Valet driver that was "caught" driving pretty fast without his knowledge of being taped...

The whole point of my original posting was to have kinda what the new corvette has, .. a "PDR" or incorporated dash cam that is "optional-to-use". No wires strung across the dash, it can be viewed on the LCD screen in the dash --if you want to-- and so on. But I believe that the Corvette does not have a dual channel system. Or does it? It would be the ultimate if it did have a rear recording cam as well ....

My ultimate car would be a Mazda 6 (because I am a guy who love gas mileage) with a dual channel system that has a system like the Corvette. I would EASILY pay an extra grand for that PDR option.
 
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