question on voltage output (cigarette lighter vs fusebox) and LK-530 operation

ncitrdude

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I have an LK-530 and an LK-7900, and I'm not sure the LK-530 is working correctly.

As of now I am just using the cigarette lighter on my car to power the 530 and the 7900, but will eventually get it hardwired.

My issue is this: The LK-530 only charges and draws vehicle power when the engine is running. When the engine is not running (even if the key is set to ON with all electronics powered including the cigarette lighter, or obviously if everything is off and key removed), power is only drawn from the LK-530 battery pack. I would have expected the LK-530 to draw from the car battery (if the cigarette lighter is providing power, even with engine off) until the car battery was below the cutoff, then switch to the internal LK-530 battery. This is not happening.

I don't have a multimeter, so I don't know the voltage coming out of the cigarette lighter, but the car battery is relatively new and I don't think there are any problems with the car battery itself.

My questions would be:

1) is it normal for the LK-530 to immediately switch to internal battery power when the engine is not running but the cigarette lighter is powered? (perhaps due to cigarette lighter voltage being below the cut-off threshold when engine is not running)

2) If so, would hard-wiring the LK-530 to a constant powered (ie non-switched) location on the car fusebox provide more voltage to the LK-530 with engine off (vs using cigarette lighter)?

My original intent was for the LK-530 to draw from the car battery even with engine off until the cut-off voltage was breached, then switch to LK-530 internal power.

Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
 

Quick

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Voltage at the cigarette lighter will be exactly the same as hardwired to the battery. In fact, the voltage will be the same anywhere in the car unless they have a converter for something like a USB plug which would be 5v. The cigarette lighter will also be fused to provide plenty of current as well (order of magnitude more than you're going to need/use). It's not that.

My guess without looking into it is that the 530 ALWAYS draws from the battery. On the camera side you draw from the battery. On the other side you charge the battery. When the input voltage drops below the cutoff it disconnects the charging side and you get power to the camera until the battery runs out.

When the car is running the alternator will be providing something like high 13s to 14v? When you turn the car off and it's battery only then the voltage will be lower. That's the only way I can see the 530 telling when the engine is off. If your battery is old/worn then the voltage drop might be greater when the engine is off. That's my guess.
 
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ncitrdude

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Gotcha, thx for the insight. I will have to wait for my multimeter to arrive and check the voltages being produced by the cigarette lighter.
 

rjk

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Mine is doing the same thing. I have it hard wired to the battery, and it does not charge when the car is not running, even when the battery voltage is over the cut off voltage. I need to get a proper multimeter to verify it, but the voltage meter on the camera itself seems pretty accurate and that's what I'm going by.

I do notice that when it is charging, the camera gets a steady 14.2 volts or so, and as soon as the car is off it drops to 11.6 volts right away. It drops to around 7 volts before cutting off completely, which seems lower than it should be going.
 

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I used my LK-7900 and the LK-530 in someone else's car once by plugging it in the cigarette lighter socket. The LK-530 did not display the "charging" status but it was actually being charged -- after a few hours of driving, the battery pack was fully charged.
 

didierm

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Mine is doing the same thing. I have it hard wired to the battery, and it does not charge when the car is not running, even when the battery voltage is over the cut off voltage. I need to get a proper multimeter to verify it, but the voltage meter on the camera itself seems pretty accurate and that's what I'm going by.

1. Does this imply that - as according to you, the battery is not charged - power to the consumer side (= dashcams) gets cut after a couple of hours (due to the LK-530 battery running out of juice), irrespective of the car battery voltage level ?

2. The LK-530 manual (http://www.lukashd.com/gnuboard4/bbs/board.php?bo_table=eng_automanual&wr_id=9 , page 4) states :
4. Lifespan of Battery
- Under the proper charging/discharging condition, it can be used up to 300 times or 60% of rated capacity.
If the LK-530 battery is continuously recharged while driving (instead of being recharged after depletion due to car battery cut-off activation), would this not imply a very short lifespan ?


Or am I seeing this all wrong ?
 

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1. Does this imply that - as according to you, the battery is not charged - power to the consumer side (= dashcams) gets cut after a couple of hours (due to the LK-530 battery running out of juice), irrespective of the car battery voltage level ?

2. The LK-530 manual (http://www.lukashd.com/gnuboard4/bbs/board.php?bo_table=eng_automanual&wr_id=9 , page 4) states :


If the LK-530 battery is continuously recharged while driving (instead of being recharged after depletion due to car battery cut-off activation), would this not imply a very short lifespan ?


Or am I seeing this all wrong ?
It's going to be a Li-Ion battery. Once it charges up the charging control circuity will cut off the charging (it has to or the battery would explode).
It's a 2.6 A(mp)H(our) capacity battery. Depending on how they list the specs that means it can supply 2.6 amps in one hour, going from fully charged to depleted.
These cameras will be drawing some thing like maybe 1/2 amp? (have to go look for that). Depends what the camera is doing at the time. The power consumption figure listed on the camera should be the absolute maximum the camera could draw in the worst case senario (all settings on max and all the LEDs on, etc.).
The 300 charges should equate to 2.6 x 300 or 780 Amp hours. So... for example if your camera draws 0.5 Amps while on battery you might expect to get at least 1,560 hours of operation before the battery's end of life. Remember that it is NOT the number of charges. It is the amount of current that goes "through" the battery. Charging puts it in, usage takes it out. If you only use 1/4 of the charge in the battery and charge it up every time then it would last for 1200 charges instead of 300.

[Edit] just looked, 7900 manual says average power consumption is 200mA. So the 530 total battery life should be good for about 3,900 hours of camera operation. And it should run the camera for about 13 hours on a single charge.
 
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didierm

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It's going to be a Li-Ion battery. Once it charges up the charging control circuity will cut off the charging (it has to or the battery would explode).
It's a 2.6 A(mp)H(our) capacity battery. Depending on how they list the specs that means it can supply 2.6 amps in one hour, going from fully charged to depleted.
These cameras will be drawing some thing like maybe 1/2 amp? (have to go look for that). Depends what the camera is doing at the time. The power consumption figure listed on the camera should be the absolute maximum the camera could draw in the worst case senario (all settings on max and all the LEDs on, etc.).
The 300 charges should equate to 2.6 x 300 or 780 Amp hours. So... for example if your camera draws 0.5 Amps while on battery you might expect to get at least 1,560 hours of operation before the battery's end of life. Remember that it is NOT the number of charges. It is the amount of current that goes "through" the battery. Charging puts it in, usage takes it out. If you only use 1/4 of the charge in the battery and charge it up every time then it would last for 1200 charges instead of 300.

[Edit] just looked, 7900 manual says average power consumption is 200mA. So the 530 total battery life should be good for about 3,900 hours of camera operation. And it should run the camera for about 13 hours on a single charge.
Dear Quick,

Thank you for your swift and extensive reply.


If I understand your explanation correctly, I would come to the following results :

1. Given :

a. Consumers :
two Livue LB-100 dashcams (front/back), totalling 600 mA (measured). Parking mode consumes somewhat less, so let's round to 500 mA ;

b. Producer :
LK-530 : 2.6 Ah x 300 charges = 780 Ah lifetime ;

c. Load :
Approx. 2 hours/day commuting time + misc. overhead, leaves approx. 22 hours/day on LK-530 battery. For the sake of simplicity : 20 h/day [*] on LK-530 battery.
[*] actually, power would be cut off after 5.2 hours, leaving your vehicle unguarded.


2. Results in :
780 Ah / (0.5A x 20h/day) = 78 days LK-530 lifetime.

3. This would equal to operational costs of (LK-530 eBay pricing) :
(365 / 78) * $ 90 = approx. $ 420 / year !?


If my calculations are correct, I fail to see how the LK-530 could be a good deal ?

(If, on the other hand, the LK-530 battery would only deplete below the car battery cut-off value, this would paint a whole other picture ; but, witness the story of ncitrdude and rjk, this is not the case.)
 

Quick

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No. When you turn your car off it will be using the car battery. Once the car battery drops to the cut-off voltage THEN you would be drawing power from the LK-530. You may (likely) never draw power from the LK-530 if you are running your car for a couple hours a day. I have a car alarm with all kinds of sensors and GPS, etc. that is all active when the car is off. My car battery will drop to where it won't start the car in about 5 days of sitting. If I had a reasonable cut off voltage it would probably get down to it in a couple of days. I would expect to be able to run everything and the camera couple of days or 3 before the camera cut over to the LK-530 battery.
 

didierm

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No. When you turn your car off it will be using the car battery. Once the car battery drops to the cut-off voltage THEN you would be drawing power from the LK-530. You may (likely) never draw power from the LK-530 if you are running your car for a couple hours a day.
That would be the logical thing to expect, but in reply to ncitrdude, you write :
My guess without looking into it is that the 530 ALWAYS draws from the battery. On the camera side you draw from the battery. On the other side you charge the battery. When the input voltage drops below the cutoff it disconnects the charging side and you get power to the camera until the battery runs out.

Maybe my confusion originates here :
Mine is doing the same thing. I have it hard wired to the battery, and it does not charge when the car is not running, even when the battery voltage is over the cut off voltage.
and here :
1) is it normal for the LK-530 to immediately switch to internal battery power when the engine is not running but the cigarette lighter is powered?
If the LK-530 switches to internal battery power when the engine is not running, the cams are depleting the internal battery, hence its lifetime decreases (300 cycles) ?

Argh ; I'm probably just being thick.
 

Quick

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My response up there is misleading but it's consistent with what they think was happening. It is possible to implement it that way but it would be the worst battery backup ever.
For the other ones it would be good to get some detail. Like what settings they were using and a multi-meter on the power source. Someone else said the charging light on their's never came on but a while later it was completely charged up. And email/inquiry to Lukas might bring an explanation also.
 
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PKNY

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From p.11 of the manual, it says: "When the voltage applied to the DC-IN terminal reaches at least 12.7V, charging will take place again."
If that's true, this UPS is pretty useless. Basically, it means charging only when the engine is running.
 

didierm

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From p.11 of the manual, it says: "When the voltage applied to the DC-IN terminal reaches at least 12.7V, charging will take place again."
If that's true, this UPS is pretty useless. Basically, it means charging only when the engine is running.
Indeed, but this is moot if the UPS is bypassed (and cams are directly fed from the car battery) as long as the car battery voltage is above the cut-off threshold.

So the basic question remains :
Is the LK-530 battery always involved in feeding the cams (with the associated reduced lifespan), or only activated after DC-IN cut-off ?
 

Quick

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From p.11 of the manual, it says: "When the voltage applied to the DC-IN terminal reaches at least 12.7V, charging will take place again."
If that's true, this UPS is pretty useless. Basically, it means charging only when the engine is running.
Not necessarily. 12.7V could be the "start charging" voltage. They imply on pages 7 & 9 that the "stop charging" cut-off voltage can be set.
"User can directly adjust the input(cut-off) voltage. (11.6V~12.4V)". My guess would be that it will charge until the input voltage drops to the configured cut-off voltage and then will not start charging until the input voltage reaches 12.7V.
 

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So the basic question remains :
Is the LK-530 battery always involved in feeding the cams (with the associated reduced lifespan), or only activated after DC-IN cut-off ?
Hi didierm, did you purchase a LK-530 after all? If you did purchase one in Jan, it means that you would have used it for over 8 months now. Are your earlier concerns about the continuous charging setup affecting the Li-Ion battery lifespan valid?

My LK-530 battery and LK-7700 camera was just delivered to my home from Korea. Have yet to fix it up in my car. I will be connecting it to the cig power outlet only. I am also concern on how best to extend the lifespan of LK-530. I got the LK-530 primarily because I do not want to be messing with the car fusebox or risk depleting my car battery with an incorrect voltage cut off selection. I am hoping that the LK-530 battery capacity should be able to give decent charge storage for at least 1.5 years, a lifespan similar to the Li-ion battery found in my smartphones. Anything less than 1.5 years, means that I won't be considering a second LK-530.
 
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didierm

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Hi didierm, did you purchase a LK-530 after all? If you did purchase one in Jan, it means that you would have used it for over 8 months now. Are your earlier concerns about the continuous charging setup affecting the Li-Ion battery lifespan valid?

My LK-530 battery and LK-7700 camera was just delivered to my home from Korea. Have yet to fix it up in my car. I will be connecting it to the cig power outlet only. I am also concern on how best to extend the lifespan of LK-530. I got the LK-530 primarily because I do not want to be messing with the car fusebox or risk depleting my car battery with an incorrect voltage cut off selection. I am hoping that the LK-530 battery capacity should be able to give decent charge storage for at least 1.5 years, a lifespan similar to the Li-ion battery found in my smartphones. Anything less than 1.5 years, means that I won't be considering a second LK-530.
Apologies for the belated reply.


I did not buy the LK-530, but decided on the LK-350-12VT(Multi).
Unfortunately, I am not very satisfied (and I doubt the LK-530 would have been any better).

As the manual states : "±5% errors in input/output voltage may occur due to surrounding environments (temperatures) and component errors." ; per its manual, the LK-530 quotes a similar deviation.

At 14V (driving), the maximum deviation is about 0.7V ; at 12.2V (parked), the deviation is still an astonishing 0.6V.
This deviation is confirmed by comparing the LK-350 LCD readouts (in/out voltage) with the readouts from a voltmeter.


This means that, even when the cut-off voltage is set at the minimal value (11.6V), I frequently find the dashcam(s) to be powered off (rendering their parking mode next to useless), while the car battery still holds a >12V voltage.

IMO, due to this large deviation, these Lukas devices are a big fail.
 

Dionic90

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same experience here. im using the TYPE C LK-290 model as ive two cams. no matter which VOLTS setting the system wants to shut off.
 

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ESguy

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Apologies for the belated reply.

I did not buy the LK-530, but decided on the LK-350-12VT(Multi).
Unfortunately, I am not very satisfied (and I doubt the LK-530 would have been any better).

As the manual states : "±5% errors in input/output voltage may occur due to surrounding environments (temperatures) and component errors." ; per its manual, the LK-530 quotes a similar deviation.

At 14V (driving), the maximum deviation is about 0.7V ; at 12.2V (parked), the deviation is still an astonishing 0.6V.
This deviation is confirmed by comparing the LK-350 LCD readouts (in/out voltage) with the readouts from a voltmeter.


This means that, even when the cut-off voltage is set at the minimal value (11.6V), I frequently find the dashcam(s) to be powered off (rendering their parking mode next to useless), while the car battery still holds a >12V voltage.

IMO, due to this large deviation, these Lukas devices are a big fail.
Sorry to hear about the voltage problems with your LK-350, but the issues may not be applicable to LK-530. The LK350 is a device to regulate the operation according to the voltage of an external power source, whereas the LK530 is the independent power source itself.

So far my LK530 has been operating as expected in my car. It is hooked up to my cig lighter hence I am unable to comment on its charging operation if it is directly wired to the car battery continuously.

As for the lifespan of my LK530 Li-ion battery, I will monitor and provide an update few months from now. I will be satisfied if still provides, say 5 hours worth of camera operation per charge (parking mode) one year from now. Right now I am getting in excess of 10 hours worth of camera operation (parking mode) per full charge.
 

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I have got Battery pack LK-530-12V. I have a problem with it.
When car running and battery pack connected output power is 14.4, when I stop the car, output power is 11.5 right away , even if battery charged FULL.
Is it should be like this or it is an issue?
 

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