Uber safe!

[Navitas]

Hello everyone, I'm new here and I am seeking your guidance. I am an Uber driver in Boston that wants to have a full comprehensive setup so that I never have to worry about anything not being recorded. I am looking ideally to get a system that has the following attributes:
- reliable
- record the front, in the cab, in the backseat, and behind the car
- ample recording time
- audio recording

no I'm no stranger to hard wiring electronics so I don't mind having a system that resides in my trunk doing all the work with remote cameras. Also, I was looking at invisible infrared light LEDs that could illuminate the inside of my car to a digital camera but still be completely dark. Unfortunately the ones I have found have been very weak and absolutely insufficient for digital lighting. If you know where I could pick some of those up that are bright like they would have in security cameras, that would be fantastic as well.

Thank you for any helpful input that you can give me here.

 

[kamkar]

You are going to have to deploy several systems then.
You can get systems that record out front of your car and back into the cabin, this cam be a 2 camera in 1 unit on the windscreen, or sort of the same but with the cabin camera on a short wire which i prefer as that let you put the main camera up high on the windscreen probably in front of mirror, and then you can offset the cabin camera to one side to get best cabin coverage or maybe on the mirror stalk

Viofo are now selling their A 129 duo in a "IR" version ( cabin camera of course have IR aid as otherwise a car cabin can be too dark at night )

Viofo A129 Duo IR review

Author's Note: The original review is found at jwtech, please head to the site to show us your support as well. Click here to view all my product reviews. Viofo has released a new infrared model of their A129 series, the A129 Duo IR. Specifically targetted for e-hailing like Uber, Grab, etc...

dashcamtalk.com

2 of those systems with the other one mounted on your rear window facing out back for the main camera and the #2 camera filming into the cabin in a forward direction, should make for good coverage.
But really i think you should start with just the one system as its front facing camera will cover far the most what happen outside, and it will log what you do with your car, so no one will be able to claim you changed lane just in front of them so they plowed into your rear.
I dont see much reason for a cabin camera in the back aimed forward, most likely you will only get a half decent face shot as people get in the car, where as a cabin camera in the front will record strait into peoples faces.
so for a rear camera you can make do with a single regular camera, but i urge you to pause this and focus on forward facing drive camera, and rear facing cabin camera in the front.

As i see it, it is a must to have your cabin camera up as high as possible too, cuz too low and the driver + seats and headrests can hide people in the back seat.
That is still a option with a camera up high, but i still think you stand a better chance with a camera up there

 

[Navitas]

I had a duel camera unit that recorded in front of the car and within the cab. However, it's been a key and decided to reject the latest memory card which doesn't seem to be anything wrong with it for any other purpose. I'd rather not think more money into that because it seems like a money pit. I was hoping for something that would be like a home security system with 4 cameras that I could very discreetly install in the ceiling.

As far as the LED lights go, any idea where I can get some that are super bright invsible light?

 

[SawMaster]

Only certain SD cards work well in video recorders- which one were you trying? And which cam? Always check cards before use- run the SDformatter tool then do a full write-test with h2testw- both are freeware.

As of right now nobody is making a 3 or 4 channel consumer-grade cam but there are rumors of at least one being in early development. The 3-4 channel commercial cams are expensive and have good video quality only on one or two channels- I don't know if IR versions are made for those.

Of standard 2-channel "Taxi" cams currently sold, the A129 IR remote looks good. I just received the new B2W and the specs look nice but I haven't tested it though it should also be good. I've ran a N2 Pro for about a year and it's OK but an it's an older design and sensor which has now been surpassed. I think Street Guardian is working on an IR cam and the unreleased K2S should have an IR version eventually. All these are well covered here on DCT except the B2W which just left beta and went onto the market a few days ago. I'll have vids from it posted in a few days I hope.

Phil

 

[kamkar]

I think the IR LED's used in these are 850 Nm wavelength, so they are a little visible as a faint red glow in darkness at least, if you don't want that you have to go up to 940 Nm wavelength that the human eye will not see.

You can find a lot of IR lights for use alongside CCTV cameras, often these are powered by 12 V so would go fine in a car, also these can be pretty strong naf have a limited spread of the light so might be overkill.
Plus i am not too sure how healthy it is sitting all night bathed in strong IR light, but i assume it is better than UV light.

I think i will be getting my B2W test sample ( new model ) tomorrow in the tracking info holds true.
But this is a 2 in 1 camera so from my standpoint not the most optimal, but for people that dont care what they have where on the windscreen, and are allowed too ( in DK you cant really put stuff in the field of view so stuff dangling from your mirror are also illegal )
Memory cards are most often the weak link in a dashcam, and no camera are set and forget, you will be wise to look over your recordings every 2-3-4 weeks to see if recordings appear good.
For the most i look for sessions starting and ending in strange places, but i also test if files are playable on my PC, and it take me around 5 - 10 minutes to sample a 128 GB memory card, which are the smallest i can recommend for a dual channel camera.

 

[kamkar]

You can get professional systems most often for commercial install, and really their footage are not that great, also they often cost a fortune at least if you go for good ones.
You can find cheap ones even 1080p on each channel, but then it might not record 30 FPS on all channels and / or the bitrate are very low and so really not suited for images with fast movement, so you can get 4 mbit which are fine for a CCTV camera filming your porch, but for filming traffic out of a windscreen you want to be in 2 digits bitrate and preferable 20 mbit or higher.

I ran such a 4 channel system many years ago, but it was SD resolution so really not all that great, and it also died before 2 years.

 

[estore009]

@Navitas Welcome to DTK! Might you have a look at our B2W Dual Lens Dash Camera!

 

[Navitas]

@Navitas Welcome to DTK! Might you have a look at our B2W Dual Lens Dash Camera!

I will eventually get a dual-lens I'm sure, the thing is is that I want complete coverage all around the car cuz if I'm going to do it I'm going to go all out. I'm thinking to get a small harbor freight setup that I could possibly adapt for my car. However I was hoping that some people here knew of something designed for the car that was already made.

 

[SawMaster]

Harbor Freight cam systems range from junk to decent for the low price when used as home cams, but their use in a vehicle would be problematic. First you'd need a DC to AC power inverter and even then those cams are not optimized for the rate of motion and the rapid lighting changes you encounter in a car. You really need purpose-built cams for car use.

Several of us here have full coverage, and all of us go about that job differently. Mine is relatively inexpensive and was originally assembled from several mostly cheap cams placed at the windows. It was upgraded with the N2 Pro and the dual-remote K2S was added later. I'll have the B2W installed in a day or two I hope- I'm having to relocate other cams to accommodate it.

A more elegant solution would be a 'Taxi' cam in front augmented by another cam (possibly a 2-channel) added for better outside rear coverage with the second channel either adding coverage somewhere else or as a back-up device for areas another cam covers (I always have 2 front cams going just in case one fails). The cam location high in front for the in-car 'Taxi' cam is ideal for coverage since it's view to the rear seat will have little in the way, and it also covers much of the front seat area too. Placing that interior cam anywhere else will result in less coverage but might let you see other places inside the car.

Until a good multi-cam system comes to market you're going to have to use more than one cam to meet all of your goals. Other than IR cams for the interior (of which there are few good ones) you have many to choose from. Decide how much you are willing to spend, then start with a 'Taxi' cam and go from there.

Phil

 

[kamkar]

It is only within the commercial realm you will see 4 or more channel cameras, it truth they are not really dashcams but more like CCTV cameras for vehicles.
So to get full coverage + cabin you need at least 5 cameras,,,,,, which funny enough are the number of cameras just on my windscreen. ( 9 cameras in total in my car all filming out )
But the largest consumer systems are only 2 channel now, and i am not even sure we will see 4 channel systems next year.
The hardware are there so it can be done on the base of that alone, but none of the dashcam makers so far have deemed it a sound financial idea to go for a 4 channel system,,,,,,, in leu of that i have argued maybe we could have some form of bus we could daisy chain 2 channel systems on.
But 4 channel are simply going to be too expensive for the general market and only a few hardcore users, or addicts will pick up such a system wen really in regard to safeguarding yourself against claims from other motorists a single front camera are just fine.
you have to remember what that single camera on your windscreen do is document everything you do, and of something happen and you with your footage can document you have done nothing wrong, then surely you can not be to blame in any way.
But i totally get you also want cabin coverage as a uber driver, that only make sense in today's world.

Of course if you want to post footage of stupid drivers on youtube to shame them, well YES then you cant really have too many cameras, but let me tell you as a person that have had 4 side coverage for a few years now around 95% of my footage for youtube come from my front camera, once in a while a little from my rear camera, and rarely from any of my side cameras, when those 2 are in play it is also usually just as B roll to what have transpired behind or in front of my car.

 

[kamkar]

Here is some footage from the cheap B1W camera mounted on my mirror stalk, works excellent in the daytime and sort of okay if you are driving in a town environment with lots of light pollution.
As you can see the ideal place for a cabin cam, at least in a little 5 door hatchback from Suzuki.

Here is a video with footage from a few of my cameras, one of the side ones among that.

 

[viofo]

You can get professional systems most often for commercial install, and really their footage are not that great, also they often cost a fortune at least if you go for good ones.
You can find cheap ones even 1080p on each channel, but then it might not record 30 FPS on all channels and / or the bitrate are very low and so really not suited for images with fast movement, so you can get 4 mbit which are fine for a CCTV camera filming your porch, but for filming traffic out of a windscreen you want to be in 2 digits bitrate and preferable 20 mbit or higher.

I ran such a 4 channel system many years ago, but it was SD resolution so really not all that great, and it also died before 2 years.

3 - 4 channel 1080P is possible with new tech, soon there will be some models in the market.

Currently only thinkware have 4 channel version, the quality seems good.

 

[kamkar]

O yeah thats right, i forgot, but also have just seen that camera on display.
It will be interesting to see how the different brands of cameras solve the problems regarding 4 channel, not least the side cameras.

 

[jokiin]

the problem is not the technology, the technology exists, finding people to buy them is the bigger challenge

 

[kamkar]

I don't want outside facing back cameras like that, it anything i would want mine to face forward a little.
For me personally first of all i would like a super nice 4K camera for my windscreen.

 

[Navitas]

I'm a big believer in covering my ass. I've been screwed over enough times we're having some footage would have been gold, so I want to try and fix that right away.

 

[Navitas]

Also, the issue with illumination. I do most of my driving when the sun is gone down. The 940nm LED lighting is very appealing to me, however it seems to be ridiculously impossible to find just a straight-up LEDs that are bright enough. I've ordered a few from here and there and they've been very disappointing. I'm looking for a two or three to focus on one location and make it very bright. That way I can just discreetly put them in the ceiling and no one would even notice them.

I'm not talkin about an array of LEDs that you buy for a night camera, single LEDs that I can install myself. does anyone have any first-hand experience on finding some really bright ones?

 

[kamkar]

For sure our world have plenty of un-classy people that will have nu quarrels wiping their mistakes off on innocent people.
BUT ! try to have in mind you don't need to have a person plowing into you in glorious HD to prove if was not your fault, at least focus on the main things which i think are the front facing camera and cabin camera.
For side cameras many of us addicts will soon install dual remote cameras in the side of out cars, these systems with small cameras on a wire should come to market soon.

 

[kamkar]

Thats easy BUT ! you will not get regular 5 mm LED's that are that strong, you need to go a little more extreme like these.

940nm Infrared LED 3W -LED TaoYuan

1.940nm Infrared LED 3W Products: Power: 3W High power infrared 3 chips in parallel, Emitted Color: Infrared IR Wavelength: 940nm DC Forward Voltage (VF): 1.5~1.7V DC Forward Current (IF): 1500mA Maximum Pulse Voltage: 1.8V Maximum Pulse Current: 1600mA 2.940nm Infrared LED 3W Control distance...

www.ledwv.com

5pc 3535 high power 3W 940nm Infrared LED Light IR led chip with 16mm Round pcb

3535 high power 3W 940nm Infrared LED Light IR led chip with 16mm Round pcb

directvoltage.com

 

[SawMaster]

I'm a big believer in covering my ass. I've been screwed over enough times we're having some footage would have been gold, so I want to try and fix that right away.

The very reason I got into dashcams my own self. It's rather drawn me in to wanting more than just a front cam, and as 'hobbies' go it can be a somewhat cheap and surely harmless pursuit The few problems I've found regards dashcams are that I don't have the money to spend on a top-level full coverage system; buying such would mean it's going to be obsolete (though hopefully still usable) a few years from now; and that I spend more time on the subject than I should

I don't "do YouTube" as many others do even though I have a channel there- my footage there is for personal reasons only beyond it's protection purposes. What I could post from one week's recording would astound you. So for me, I want an excellent front cam, a very good rear cam, decent cams for my sides, and a 'back-up' for the all-important front and rear cams where most of the action happens. My interior IR cam is mostly to protect the contents of my workvan; a similar need to yours. My cheap side-cams aren't very useful at night, nor is my current main rear cam (I had reliability problems with the one I originally used there) but for proving traffic positioning and car movements they'll do. It's the difference between 'adequate' and 'optimum'. There are many better affordable cams for that purpose today- what the current crop of low-light sensors has done is almost a total game-changer regards dashcams

Uber and Taxi drivers absolutely need an interior-covering IR equipped cam at the barest minimum. IMHO the A129 with IR remote impresses me the most both for better interior and front-of-car video. I hope the new B2W at least matches it as both use the better Sony Starvis "300" series sensors which are as good as you'll find in dashcams today- we will know that very soon The form-factors vary with these and may play a role in your choice. The IR illumination all these have out-of-the-box seems to be good enough and TBH not many people will much notice any faint visible light coming from the 850nm LED's. Many like me can't see it at all so it's not something I'd worry about. If you do upgrade to 940nm LED's the cams may not work as well as they are tuned to work best with the original LED's- I'm not the best source of info on that. My old N2 Pro clearly illuminates the back of my workvan 5 meters from the cam and what I've seen of the others looks equally strong and good TBH if I were a taxi or Uber driver I'd have easily-seen signage letting my passengers know they were on camera and they'd have to accept those terms to ride with me. It's simply not worth a few bucks to gain a fare with such a loss of security- another fare will come along shortly anyhow. That signage will do as much to CYA as the cam will since people do tend to behave better when they know they are being watched and recorded.

Phil