What Are the Most Important Dash Cam Features?

[SawMaster]

Whether notified by beeps, voice, or flashing lights you're going to want to exit the roadway to fix things so as far as I'm concerned any method will do and is far better than none. We're limited with what we can do by the roadside anyway- maybe swap or format the card in the cam at best- and if that doesn't fix it (which it usually does) then we're going to try another fix when we get home where our time and diagnostic resources are better.

Just let me know by both sound and light that the cam isn't recording- I think that's enough for most of us Better would be nice, just not absolutely necessary.

Phil

 

[arcticfire]

Perhaps a real drive towards hdd based cams could solve a lot of reliability issues. We have a few compact dvrs with four camera setups in our trucks which could also be fairly easy to install in cars. But they are only 720p and not the best 720p at that, but good enough and in the last few years I've yet to have one fail to record.

 

[Nath]

HDD is not reliable storage medium for cars. The ones which are able to withstand so much vibrations, rotations and wide temperature/humidity range are pretty expensive.

 

[Dashmellow]

HDD is not reliable storage medium for cars. The ones which are able to withstand so much vibrations, rotations and wide temperature/humidity range are pretty expensive.

That's not really true anymore. You can buy tiny high capacity SSDs these days which are essentially immune to shock, vibrations, moisture and temperature extremes.

We've actually been having conversations about this concept here on DCT for some years now. Initially it was just a fantasy due to the prohibitive prices even though the technology already existed. Since then, prices have dropped precipitously so they are getting closer to reality for this application than they once were.

The Samsung T5 (500 GB) is available for about $90 USD. The product is also available in 1TB or 2TB. A manufacturer buying in quantity could obtain drives like this for quite a bit less.

I believe we will eventually see drives like this incorporated into automotive cameras assuming the buying public is willing to absorb the additional cost. Then again the prices are not all that much more than large memory cards and still dropping.

 

[Nath]

You didn’t get the point, HDD isn’t SSD...

And no, even SSD has to use “better” memory (slightly expensive) to by able to work (without failure) in -20°C. Not to mention higher levels of air-moisture AND memory cell durability.

Btw: No wonder the Samsung T5 is so cheap, it uses TLC... Have you tried to use it as a camera storage 24/7?

 

[Dashmellow]

You didn’t get the point, HDD isn’t SSD...

And no, even SSD has to use “better” memory (slightly expensive) to by able to work (without failure) in -20°C. Not to mention higher levels of air-moisture AND memory cell durability.

Btw: No wonder the Samsung T5 is so cheap, it uses TLC... Have you tried to use it as a camera storage 24/7?

I wasn't suggesting the Samsung itself specifically for dash cam storage. It was to suggest that solid state memory technology is reaching a stage where it will eventually be used for this application.

Why even discuss HDD for dash cams anyway? As you point out it is indeed unworkable, so why even go there? The compact automotive DVRs mentioned in the post you were responding to usually use SD cards for memory storage.

 

[Fari]

That's not really true anymore. You can buy tiny high capacity SSDs these days which are essentially immune to shock, vibrations, moisture and temperature extremes.

We've actually been having conversations about this concept here on DCT for some years now. Initially it was just a fantasy due to the prohibitive prices even though the technology already existed. Since then, prices have dropped precipitously so they are getting closer to reality for this application than they once were.

The Samsung T5 (500 GB) is available for about $90 USD. The product is also available in 1TB or 2TB. A manufacturer buying in quantity could obtain drives like this for quite a bit less.

I believe we will eventually see drives like this incorporated into automotive cameras assuming the buying public is willing to absorb the additional cost. Then again the prices are not all that much more than large memory cards and still dropping.

View attachment 48114

Even the price for SSDs dropped significantly, they are quite big to be integrated into dash cams, or else most companies would have offered them instead of unreliable and low-memory SSD cards.

 

[Nigel]

Even the price for SSDs dropped significantly, they are quite big to be integrated into dash cams, or else most companies would have offered them instead of unreliable and low-memory SSD cards.

SSD and microSD use similar technology for the storage, they should have similar reliability. We only see reliability issues on microSD when people use low quality ones, they are run too hot, or simply because they wear out through 24/7 recording. Put an SSD in the same conditions and unless it is one of the more expensive MLC ones you will get the same reliability issues, use a more expensive MLC microSD card and it will match the reliability of the best SSDs.

 

[Nath]

I wasn't suggesting the Samsung itself specifically for dash cam storage. It was to suggest that solid state memory technology is reaching a stage where it will eventually be used for this application.

Why even discuss HDD for dash cams anyway? As you point out it is indeed unworkable, so why even go there? The compact automotive DVRs mentioned in the post you were responding to usually use SD cards for memory storage.

You weren't ... but that's the main reason for the price drop - manufactures sell TLC and QLC memories. To hide the fact of garbage NAND chips they include few percent of SLC or MLC as a cache to get good scores in benchmarks. And as i've mentioned before, none of them are more durable (means 0-70°C working temperature, 0-80% humidity - even the most common MLC or SLC).

Anyway, m.2 (at least size) could be usefull slot in dashcam.

 

[SawMaster]

SD cards aren't the best possible answer, but for the purpose we're using them for here they as good of an answer as we have right now. As technology develops that will change, just as we went from videotape to better methods of holding our video data. The same kind of thing will happen with dashcams eventually.

I'm sure we all like the concept of using a large drive which can handle multiple cams, and it has proven workable with the commercial 'truck cams' we have right now. As I see things, what we're seeing with this today is the manifestation of the perspective being used in approaching the matter at hand. Those making simple dashcams know and understand how crucial high-res video quality is, and they get it for us. Those making the truck cams know and understand how crucial large reliable storage capacity is, and they deliver that. If we could meld the two approaches together we'd have the cams we want But instead we're forced to choose between bad vids but lots of them or good vids and a questionable storage method You'll see this phenomena at work with Anker and Garmin, who are tops with technology but who have had trouble making dashcams which do as we want them to do. Part of that is their lack of experience in the dashcam field and part of that is in their approach to the matter.- they think their knowledge of technology in general is sufficient for them to automatically make good cams And part is that neither approach has bothered to embrace the other one; each simply goes their own way because they're most comfortable with that approach.

Some day we will get and have what we want: multiple high-res cams and high reliable storage capacity together in a relatively affordable unit. Whoever does that first will cause the dashcam market to change with their success being wanted by their competitors. Until that happens all we can do is wait and hope...

Phil

 

[Nigel]

I think microSD cards will soon be big enough, for a 1080 dashcam I've always found 64GB adequate, for a dual 1080 dashcam 128GB is adequate, and both those sizes are now cheap. With 4K dashcams we need double the size, 4x the size for the best quality, 4x 128GB = 512GB which is the maximum common micro SD card size so still rather expensive, but 1TB cards are now available so the 512GB should be reasonable cost by next year, and there are currently no dual 4K cameras available anyway, 4K+1080 only needs a 256GB card for decent quality and 8 hours, and they are already reasonably cheap. So a couple more years and the reasonably priced microSD cards will be big enough for nearly everyone, and I can't see 8K dashcams becoming normal for a very long time since dual 4K is perfectly adequate for most people, and installing side cameras is too much for most people. For the truck and taxi drivers who need to record for more than 8 hours a day, well they can use a lower bitrate, unless you are making movies then you don't need 64Mb/s 4K video, 32Mb/s is still decent quality for evidence purposes.

 

[SawMaster]

It's not so much the card size, but the fact that they don't all work as they should, either due to low write speeds (which will become more of an issue as cams go with higher bitrates and higher IQ), and that they wear out and fail in use (sometimes not the card but the socket) with little or no warning. SSD's are far more reliable in use, can have ginormous write speeds, and don't need to be removed for easy data transfer. Plus an SSD isn't going to fly down into a defroster vent or into some other inaccessible place in your car It's better technology than micro SD cards- just not being well adapted to our needs yet

Phil

 

[Fari]

SD cards aren't the best possible answer, but for the purpose we're using them for here they as good of an answer as we have right now. As technology develops that will change, just as we went from videotape to better methods of holding our video data. The same kind of thing will happen with dashcams eventually.

I'm sure we all like the concept of using a large drive which can handle multiple cams, and it has proven workable with the commercial 'truck cams' we have right now. As I see things, what we're seeing with this today is the manifestation of the perspective being used in approaching the matter at hand. Those making simple dashcams know and understand how crucial high-res video quality is, and they get it for us. Those making the truck cams know and understand how crucial large reliable storage capacity is, and they deliver that. If we could meld the two approaches together we'd have the cams we want But instead we're forced to choose between bad vids but lots of them or good vids and a questionable storage method You'll see this phenomena at work with Anker and Garmin, who are tops with technology but who have had trouble making dashcams which do as we want them to do. Part of that is their lack of experience in the dashcam field and part of that is in their approach to the matter.- they think their knowledge of technology in general is sufficient for them to automatically make good cams And part is that neither approach has bothered to embrace the other one; each simply goes their own way because they're most comfortable with that approach.

Some day we will get and have what we want: multiple high-res cams and high reliable storage capacity together in a relatively affordable unit. Whoever does that first will cause the dashcam market to change with their success being wanted by their competitors. Until that happens all we can do is wait and hope...

Phil

I enjoy reading your comments, Phil. I think the other possible solution can be cloud storage which can help us eliminate the need for expensive large storage capacity. But then if you look into the infrastructure, it is still questionable. Because with cloud storage comes connectivity, either 4G-5G/WiFi, and depending on geographic location and service providers it can bring up challenges, and make SSDs more reliable in some situations.

 

[country_hick]

I enjoy reading your comments, Phil. I think the other possible solution can be cloud storage which can help us eliminate the need for expensive large storage capacity. But then if you look into the infrastructure, it is still questionable. Because with cloud storage comes connectivity, either 4G-5G/WiFi, and depending on geographic location and service providers it can bring up challenges, and make SSDs more reliable in some situations.

Cloud storage is not the answer and probably never will be. First, real time streaming uses massive bandwidth. That gets expensive quick. Second, not every location has facilities required to transmit from your car. Third, not everyone has cloud service. Fourth, buying cloud service would cost more per year than the most expensive dashcam does. Economics do matter.

A hybrid solution could work. Not constant cloud storage but rather after pressing a button or when a motion event occurs send the previous 30 seconds and then next minute of event to the cloud. Until cloud service can handle the massive amounts of data in real time at a very affordable rate we are stuck with local data storage.

SSD (or something else better than that to be invented) is likely to be the future. Of course, 2 drives are needed. One to record, one to take over instantaneously when the first drive fails.

I would like to see remote cameras that only have a lens and a cable leading to a central unit that does all the work. Some motorcycle dashcams like this exist but apparently are not optimal for car dash cam use.

 

[Fari]

Cloud storage is not the answer and probably never will be. First, real time streaming uses massive bandwidth. That gets expensive quick. Second, not every location has facilities required to transmit from your car. Third, not everyone has cloud service. Fourth, buying cloud service would cost more per year than the most expensive dashcam does. Economics do matter.

A hybrid solution could work. Not constant cloud storage but rather after pressing a button or when a motion event occurs send the previous 30 seconds and then next minute of event to the cloud. Until cloud service can handle the massive amounts of data in real time at a very affordable rate we are stuck with local data storage.

SSD (or something else better than that to be invented) is likely to be the future. Of course, 2 drives are needed. One to record, one to take over instantaneously when the first drive fails.

I would like to see remote cameras that only have a lens and a cable leading to a central unit that does all the work. Some motorcycle dashcams like this exist but apparently are not optimal for car dash cam use.

I really believe that 5G connectivity has a solution for this, but it's still under development and comprehensive rollouts expected in 2020. It can offer peak speeds up to 10Gbps and has very low latency, which can transmit the data faster.

 

[Nath]

Forget about "5G". It uses frequencies so high that it almost needs direct sight to the receiver. Perhaps it will work in large cities with large amount of APs but otherwise... (at least if the car won't have Wifi AP inside with 5G antenna on a roof)

 

[GTA Driver]

That's a solid point, but spoken error message could make the product cost higher, and people don't prefer high-cost, yet error informing products

My second camera, a somewhat pricey one at that, a Jaewoncnc Iroad 3300 ch has some of its messages in spoken English. Its been over a year since I ran it regularly, but I believe it had

• "Have a safe drive" when powering on
• "We can not find an SD card"

I can't recall if the spoken words can be turned off , but I can recall some of the Koreans here in DCT users disliking it and wanting to know if it can be turned off

Although I would like the spoken words improved, its something I kind of miss when going to Viofo and Mobius products however I prefer the latter as it has better resolution and GPS. Although the 3300 ch had GPS, the speed could only be seen on its viewer. It not place on the video. Also the GPS did not set the time.

If I have to spend an extra $20 to 30 it would be on GPS. I can live without the voice notifications. I regret I didn't shell out a little more for a back camera with GPS.

The Iroad 3300Ch was a cylinder type camera, similar in form factor to the blueSkysea b1w, but without wifi. As such it required more voice notification as it has no screen or way to interact with it from a smart phone. It would be nice if, there was a voice notification.

• when the audio was turned off. I would hit the event\emergency button and mistakenly hit the the audio. It would be nice if it said audio off
• "event record" when pressing an event.
• messages about SD card status, not just finding it but if formatting is recommended.
• "Have a safe drive" not only when powering on, but detecting motion after being stopped for over 10 minutes. When I hard wired the 3300, the notification of course would not come up. I had a member of the family pulling the cords and thus I had no way of telling if the dash cam was on or NOT unless I looked for it.

 

[arcticfire]

HDD is not reliable storage medium for cars. The ones which are able to withstand so much vibrations, rotations and wide temperature/humidity range are pretty expensive.

The three we have installed have been 100% reliable so I'm not sure why you say this?

They are Durite small form DVR 720p, HDD included, four cameras, 7" monitor and fully installed into HGVs with a lot of extra cabling due to size of vehicle. £1400 each which includes professional installation costs.

A few years ago I managed to source a company in China which do a similar setup but I think it's 1080p, although the bit rates were much lower than regular dashcams but the sample quality looked good. I'll need to check but I'm sure the price was around £400. That's not bad for a four camera HDD setup, even if the quality may be a little lower.

The DVR can be tucked away under a seat or in the boot. I think the tech is coming but just slowly, probably because the bulk of demand is commercial and the quality tends to be just acceptable rather than excellent.

 

[lacibaci]

It's not so much the card size, but the fact that they don't all work as they should, either due to low write speeds (which will become more of an issue as cams go with higher bitrates and higher IQ), and that they wear out and fail in use (sometimes not the card but the socket) with little or no warning. SSD's are far more reliable in use, can have ginormous write speeds, and don't need to be removed for easy data transfer. Plus an SSD isn't going to fly down into a defroster vent or into some other inaccessible place in your car It's better technology than micro SD cards- just not being well adapted to our needs yet

Phil

Speaking of SSDs I don't understand why they are not being used in dashcams yet. These days an SSD is cheaper than a large capacity SD card.

 

[Fari]

My second camera, a somewhat pricey one at that, a Jaewoncnc Iroad 3300 ch has some of its messages in spoken English. Its been over a year since I ran it regularly, but I believe it had

• "Have a safe drive" when powering on
• "We can not find an SD card"

I can't recall if the spoken words can be turned off , but I can recall some of the Koreans here in DCT users disliking it and wanting to know if it can be turned off

Although I would like the spoken words improved, its something I kind of miss when going to Viofo and Mobius products however I prefer the latter as it has better resolution and GPS. Although the 3300 ch had GPS, the speed could only be seen on its viewer. It not place on the video. Also the GPS did not set the time.

If I have to spend an extra $20 to 30 it would be on GPS. I can live without the voice notifications. I regret I didn't shell out a little more for a back camera with GPS.

The Iroad 3300Ch was a cylinder type camera, similar in form factor to the blueSkysea b1w, but without wifi. As such it required more voice notification as it has no screen or way to interact with it from a smart phone. It would be nice if, there was a voice notification.

• when the audio was turned off. I would hit the event\emergency button and mistakenly hit the the audio. It would be nice if it said audio off
• "event record" when pressing an event.
• messages about SD card status, not just finding it but if formatting is recommended.
• "Have a safe drive" not only when powering on, but detecting motion after being stopped for over 10 minutes. When I hard wired the 3300, the notification of course would not come up. I had a member of the family pulling the cords and thus I had no way of telling if the dash cam was on or NOT unless I looked for it.

The GPS in my dashcam always tells me directions, speed limit, and location, but it gets really annoying sometimes because even if I know my way, or want to speed up, I constantly get those spoken commands. But then, even if you want to turn it off, there is no clear instruction about it.