Why are dashcams video quality still so bad?

[jokiin]

Some more than others

 

[Dashmellow]

Some more than others

I'm always amazed and gratified by how reliable my Mobius cameras are. This winter was long and harsh out where I live and the result was that I gave scant attention to reviewing footage from my rear and side cameras. The last thing I really feel like doing is messing with microSD cards when the temperature is well below zero and it is snowing out. When I finally got around to popping the cards from the Mobius cams when Daylight savings time came around I discovered that they had continued to hum away all winter with no problems. Of course, it helps that they have blinking LEDs to keep an eye on but best practice for dash cams is to actually confirm their operation by reviewing footage periodically.

 

[Deleted member 37895]

Video quality is great considering the bitrate. You can build a dashcam with a far higher bitrate, and you'd only get a few hours on a 64gb SD card

 

[c4rc4m]

The memory card is the weak link in any camera so can never be totally set and forget

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I've never found that personally. Then again, many dashcams seem very fussy about memory card choice, whereas action cameras seem a little more relaxed.

Something that may surprise a few people, is that in both my Mobius 1 B and my Hero 2, I have Sandisk Pro cards - Sandisk seem to be reported as problematic in many dashcams. What may be even more surprising, is the memory card in my Hero 2 was bought in 2011, the same time as the camera. The camera is used daily as a dashcam, and the card's never been replaced or missed a beat. Only issue I do have (which I suspect is down to the way memory is structured is that as it approaches the very end of the card, it starts to throw up low speed card warnings when start recording (you just restart it to clear). That said, I actually don't mind as the Hero 2 being an early camera doesn't have looping and so it serves as a reminder to clear the card either then or in the next few journeys.

Haven't used the Mobius 1 B for as long, but that never had any card issues either.

I'm always amazed and gratified by how reliable my Mobius cameras are. This winter was long and harsh out where I live and the result was that I gave scant attention to reviewing footage from my rear and side cameras. The last thing I really feel like doing is messing with microSD cards when the temperature is well below zero and it is snowing out. When I finally got around to popping the cards from the Mobius cams when Daylight savings time came around I discovered that they had continued to hum away all winter with no problems. Of course, it helps that they have blinking LEDs to keep an eye on but best practice for dash cams is to actually confirm their operation by reviewing footage periodically.

I can't argue there. My Mobius 1 bounced off my dashboard more time than I can ever imagine and always worked perfectly. It was only when I dropped it on my tiled floor and it landed perfectly lens down, did I experience a problem. I'm sure the rubberised exterior helped a lot though. Pity they've now dropped that.

 

[Dashmellow]

I can't argue there. My Mobius 1 bounced off my dashboard more time than I can ever imagine and always worked perfectly. It was only when I dropped it on my tiled floor and it landed perfectly lens down, did I experience a problem. I'm sure the rubberised exterior helped a lot though. Pity they've now dropped that.

The silicone coating on your Mobius is only microns thick and it is a mere fantasy to believe that it protected the camera from breakage from your chronic habit of dropping it. It is the design, thickness, rounded corners and build quality of the housing that makes it so durable. Such silicone coatings are applied to plastic products primarily for the tactile and gripping qualities it provides along with an attractive matte finish.

I have always been mystified why you perpetually repeat this same story to us over and over about dropping and breaking your Mobius rather than just simply install a replacement lens like most owners do when they damage the lens on this particular camera. It is an extraordinarily easy and inexpensive procedure and could also accommodate one of those high-end optics you are so enamored of.

 

[c4rc4m]

The camera was pretty worn out anyway. USB issue was long standing and so by the time I'd bought a main board as well I might as well have bought a new camera. Thanks for the case information.

 

[arsh]

I'm sure this was beaten to death by now but in short the iphone was several hundred when it was new, your average dash cam is not. Even with the price deduction on that a 5c is like $100, a $60 dashcam has WAY better video quality now. Honestly i use an gs8000l most of the time and that 5c was barely better and the gs8000ls run $20

 

[country_hick]

I keep wondering how long we have to wait for SSD tech to replace micro-sd cards in dash cams.

 

[c4rc4m]

I keep wondering how long we have to wait for SSD tech to replace micro-sd cards in dash cams.

Hopefully not in the short term!

The problem with internal fixed memory is all memory chips have write limitations in terms of the number of times they can be written to after which they degrade and blocks of memory start to fail causing loss of data. With a dashcam you are writing to the memory continuously so it's only a matter of time before the memory fails. With an SD card, you simply throw the card away and buy a new card. With an SSD with flash or DRAM memory, either the whole camera would have to be trashed as the memory would be fixed internally, or if you could replace the memory yourself, either by design or your own skills through it being plug and play internally and not soldered, the replacement memory itself is going to be far more expensive than an SD card as SD flash can be manufactured far cheaper. I also think, but am not totally sure, that SSD's require more memory controller functions and as the memory controller is mounted on the SSD board, this again is likely to make it more expensive. Whilst SD cards do have a small onboard controller, I believe a lot of the functions are in the camera itself in the form of the card reader. SD cards are also designed to be robust and sustain being inserted / removed. SSD's aren't as robust in this regard.

So basically, whilst an SSD is more suited to repeated read / write operations, it is still going to wear out and will either cost you a new camera or more money to replace if it's replaceable.

I guess the holy grail would be if someone could come up with a DRAM SSD that is small enough to be plugged in like an SD card making it removable and cheap enough to be replaceable. That would overcome the poor lifespan issues of some flash cards and hopefully the compatibility issues through a standard memory controller as with pc's.

However, I rather think the real answer in the short term is for SD card manufacturers to actually come up with dashcam specific cards that can take the constant write cycles and don't have the controller issues we seem to be seeing with some cards as I don't see an SSD being competitive or available short term.

 

[thancam]

my mobius 1 has sensor issues after running nonstop in almost a year at highest bitrate. But it's still very amazing with a tiny cam only cost 100$.
( I live in a tropical climate city)
PS: the image begin blurry. I did try to re-focus the lens but it doesnt work.

 

[jokiin]

Running like that in those conditions will eventually take a toll on any camera

 

[Dashmellow]

my mobius 1 has sensor issues after running nonstop in almost a year at highest bitrate. But it's still very amazing with a tiny cam only cost 100$.
( I live in a tropical climate city)
PS: the image begin blurry. I did try to re-focus the lens but it doesnt work.

Sounds like the sensor or backing plate may have warped from the heat. The thing with the Mobius is that if you pop in a new lens module you would likely be right back in business with the camera and you'd be good for another year of full time service.

 

[thancam]

Running like that in those conditions will eventually take a toll on any camera

i still have 3 - 5 more to go. Mobius is very hard to sold in my market.

Sounds like the sensor or backing plate may have warped from the heat. The thing with the Mobius is that if you pop in a new lens module you would likely be right back in business with the camera and you'd be good for another year of full time service.

i asked for lens but they (china seller) only sell both sensor and lens. The cost was around half of new mobius. That's ok. Only a testing. I still have plenty to use

 

[Deleted member 37895]

Hopefully not in the short term!

The problem with internal fixed memory is all memory chips have write limitations in terms of the number of times they can be written to after which they degrade and blocks of memory start to fail causing loss of data. With a dashcam you are writing to the memory continuously so it's only a matter of time before the memory fails. With an SD card, you simply throw the card away and buy a new card. With an SSD with flash or DRAM memory, either the whole camera would have to be trashed as the memory would be fixed internally, or if you could replace the memory yourself, either by design or your own skills through it being plug and play internally and not soldered, the replacement memory itself is going to be far more expensive than an SD card as SD flash can be manufactured far cheaper. I also think, but am not totally sure, that SSD's require more memory controller functions and as the memory controller is mounted on the SSD board, this again is likely to make it more expensive. Whilst SD cards do have a small onboard controller, I believe a lot of the functions are in the camera itself in the form of the card reader. SD cards are also designed to be robust and sustain being inserted / removed. SSD's aren't as robust in this regard.

So basically, whilst an SSD is more suited to repeated read / write operations, it is still going to wear out and will either cost you a new camera or more money to replace if it's replaceable.

I guess the holy grail would be if someone could come up with a DRAM SSD that is small enough to be plugged in like an SD card making it removable and cheap enough to be replaceable. That would overcome the poor lifespan issues of some flash cards and hopefully the compatibility issues through a standard memory controller as with pc's.

However, I rather think the real answer in the short term is for SD card manufacturers to actually come up with dashcam specific cards that can take the constant write cycles and don't have the controller issues we seem to be seeing with some cards as I don't see an SSD being competitive or available short term.

It would be nice if they used full size SD cards which can be had at 512GB for $250, or even 1TB for astronomical amounts of money

 

[c4rc4m]

You need the sensor as my understanding of the internals is the plate that warps is on the back of the sensor.

 

[Bungus]

i still have 3 - 5 more to go. Mobius is very hard to sold in my market.

i asked for lens but they (china seller) only sell both sensor and lens. The cost was around half of new mobius. That's ok. Only a testing. I still have plenty to use

I originally wanted to buy a C2 lens only to replace my A lens from eletoponline365. they replied they only sell with sensor for IIRC USD 38.00. When I mention to them that the C2 sensor will not fit in my housing, they gave me a housing at no charge. On receiving the items, I'm only short of a PC board to complete a camera, so I bought a PC board for another USD 38.00 and got a complete camera. You being a retailer should be able to get for less.

You should sell your Mobius stock as helmet cam. With over a million mopeds in your City, will be a easy sell.

 

[jokiin]

You being a retailer should be able to get for less.

don't count on it, their wholesale price for the whole camera to the resellers is only $8 less than they retail it for

 

[thancam]

don't count on it, their wholesale price for the whole camera to the resellers is only $8 less than they retail it for

Yeah. That happen when a camera almost dont need warranty. People simply buy online from the manufacturer with the cheapest price.
So, lucky. The some of electronic stuffs always be failure at sometime and customers need resellers, need service after all.

 

[SawMaster]

Higher bitrate equals higher heat at the sensor. I run the 'normal' bitrate on mine and even in the high summer heat here, I've had no problems at all. I'm still getting good images so I'm leaving that setting where it is.

Phil

 

[Deleted member 37895]

Higher bitrate equals higher heat at the sensor. I run the 'normal' bitrate on mine and even in the high summer heat here, I've had no problems at all. I'm still getting good images so I'm leaving that setting where it is.

Phil

No, higher bitrate means less compression hence less processing power which should mean less heat at the processor chip. The heat at the sensor itself is the same because the sensor captures a raw image