why is battery bad for dash cams in hot weather but not for bluetooth speakers or other devices?

DieselFish

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I'm a newbie.

I read many threads in this forum about how having a built-in rechargeable Li-ion battery is bad for dash cams
in hot weather. (even when the car is parked under the sun) Some have said the best solution is a capacitor
instead of a battery.

However, my Jabra Bluetooth speakerphone on my visor has a built-in Li-ion battery and it has survive 100+
degree weather for several summers. Before that, my previous visor-mounted no-frills Bluetooth
speakerphone also got along just fine for 5+ years. I never take my cell phones out of the car because they
are factory cell phones that have their own mounts inside the center armrest. Their batteries also never gave
me any troubles.

So how come a battery is bad when it comes to dash cams? Is it because they usually use unreliable batteries?
 
Stick it in the window and you'll magnify the problem, constantly charging it, or worse, permanently powering it makes it even more risky
 
I think because the many dash cams use the cheapest and lowest quality batteries available to cut costs. Also the camera mounts directly to the windshield which in direct sunlight is probably the hottest place in the whole car.
 
I talked to my local chemistry expert about Li-ion batteries, excessive heat is the enemy of all batteries, but the Li-ion battery holds up to excessive heat the best.

The end result will depend on the quality of the battery and if it's in the sun or in shade. A direct hit by the sun will make it a lot hotter.
 
Maybe gel-batteries could be a solution ?
 
not really, the charge cycles would still remain as proble...everytime you turn your vehicle on...its a new charge cycle even if the battery is full and its unnecessary to charge ...and the huge amount of these cycles harms the battery a lot, especially if battery is full or empty the voltage of charging is highest and harms most
only if dashcam has smart electronics that dont charge it if full this issue is resolved(which i doubt, i think the electronic inside is very stupid and simple...)

heat AND cold, both harm the battery a lot, being gel would not change anything...since the heat and cold boost chemical reactions inside the battery, you cant prevent that unless you would climate the battery
and since the battery provides power due to chemical reactions....these reaction are always present, even if the battery is doing nothing...thus its always doing something inside(aging)
 
not really, the charge cycles would still remain as proble...everytime you turn your vehicle on...its a new charge cycle even if the battery is full and its unnecessary to charge ...and the huge amount of these cycles harms the battery a lot, especially if battery is full or empty the voltage of charging is highest and harms most
only if dashcam has smart electronics that dont charge it if full this issue is resolved(which i doubt, i think the electronic inside is very stupid and simple...)

Number of charge cycles in itself has no effect on anything.
Simplifying a bit, Li-Ion batteries MUST have electronics to control charging. Basically, it either works or the battery blows up. Since the camera pretty much draws a fixed amount of current (whatever the max is) there probably isn't any circuitry to control discharge. Again, it either works or the battery blows up.

The link jokiin pointed to is an excellent resource for beginning and intermediate battery information.
 
I think because the many dash cams use the cheapest and lowest quality batteries available to cut costs. Also the camera mounts directly to the windshield which in direct sunlight is probably the hottest place in the whole car.

this certainly makes it much more risky, a lot of cameras use very low quality batteries, if you saw the difference in price between good cells and the stuff that's commonly used you would shake your head in disbelief, that said though even the highest quality cells aren't really suitable anyway
 
thats just a bit information... and very general and limited...im sorry even wikipedia is more useful than this

Number of charge cycles in itself has no effect on anything.
Simplifying a bit, Li-Ion batteries MUST have electronics to control charging. Basically, it either works or the battery blows up. Since the camera pretty much draws a fixed amount of current (whatever the max is) there probably isn't any circuitry to control discharge. Again, it either works or the battery blows up.

The link jokiin pointed to is an excellent resource for beginning and intermediate battery information.

the number of charge cycles has very much effect, in fact it IS the MAIN thing that destroys your battery in normal environment, currently ANY battery...(besides temperature...but this is a natural fact since you wouldnt expect yor refrigerator to work on 100°C environment properly either...)
maybe i was too general, and not detailed enough....yes the lithium inside your battery does not care about the cycles...it could handle many more... but the electrode/collector that leads the electric energy out of the battery and when charging inside battery dissolves over the charging cycling until it can not anymore provide good enough ability for charging and drawing out the energy
especially the charging cycle when battery is nerly full or very empty put a lot stress on it and produces much damage

this can be adressed with good electronics, but is still one of the main unsolved problems of Li-Io batterys, if not the main one...

and to be honest, i agree the dash cams are a great piece of chinese engineering
but having looked inside some of them, fake and originals.... i dont have enough trust in that electronics...no, in the manufacturers, to have build in that smart electronic and thinking that far ahead, to have selected parts that are not dangerous...
not to mention feeling save that my dashcam wont blow up inside my car at some time... i have always that on my mind especially on summer heatwaves, you should too

why?
-because i own the cheaper models below $60 that mostly just appear and few months later disappear from market
-because i dont trust their electronic parts selection
-because there are many strange manufacturers, and some are just copying making it look land working like original without underrstanding it... without caring for actual purpose of the parts and plan
-because most of them are just out for the fast money and dont care for customers that bought it
-because once you bought it, its not their problem but yours, especially if youre far away
-because there ere exponetially more models that are trash and unreliable, overheating, breaking, dying etc than REALLY WORKING ones
THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF THIS FORUM IS TO IDENTIFY THE GOOD ONES LOL!
-because even reputable manufacterers are behaving like amateurs with their customers, provding only commercial information that is partly false, not supporting their product and after few months droping it and releasing the next dash cam, that s actually with a high chance worse than its predecessor
i could go on and on.... but i dont think its necessary ;)
 
Well i saw you own a lukas...maybe you can trust your manufacturer....
but you shouldnt lump all dashcams together and make claims that we should trust the electronics...just buy a few of the hot selling dashcams here, open them up and have a look at the electronics and especially the battery and you will see what i mean
its just taht currently if you dont have hundreds of dollars, you have no choice but to buy these dashcams...since in our countrys the industry completely ignores our needs of such a device
and none of these chinese cams manufacturers would probably be able to survive on our markets simply by the fact that the licenses and patents here would crush them preventing from producing such devices or making them expensive to the point of not affordable for most
 
Why can't we build them like reverse cameras...
Camera eye bit on the windshield and cable all the way back to centre console or glovebox where everything else resides? Or attach body to visor.


Regards
Duke
 
I will bite. :) What are the complications


Regards
Duke
 
I will bite. :) What are the complications


Regards
Duke
they're not comparable products at all, analogue video is very simple, I'm not going to go through the detail as there's plenty of it, plenty of posts here already about different formats as well if you want to read up on it
 
Why can't we build them like reverse cameras...
Camera eye bit on the windshield and cable all the way back to centre console or glovebox where everything else resides? Or attach body to visor.


Regards
Duke

Or maybe you could take battery out of camera and put it at the end of 2 meter cable and hide battery in some cool place, in to place where the sun don't shine...
 
Or maybe you could take battery out of camera and put it at the end of 2 meter cable and hide battery in some cool place, in to place where the sun don't shine...

Powered by fart. :p


Regards
Duke
 
Generally if a premium battery goes from Full charge to Full Discharge before being recharged, it's good for about 500 cycles.
If it goes from Full Charge to 90% then gets recharged, it's good for about 5,000 cycles. If this happens once a day, that's about 14 years.
If left on a charging voltage all the time the batteries will swell up (and may rupture), the charging system needs to 'cut out' when it detects a Full Charge.
My X6 has the 'cut out' circuitry because the red (charging active) led hardly ever comes on. If it does come on I have to uplug the power and then plug it back in to turn off the red led, which I do after about a minute, any sooner and it comes back on. Probably a slight bug.

The statistics were given to me by a supplier of scanning devices used in warehouses. A battery would last about 1 shift of 8 hours if the scanner was used frequently. Therefore we bought extra batteries and had the workers swap batteries halfway through their shift and never had a battery issue in years of operation. If we hadn't, with two shifts, 5 days/week, the originals would have had to be replaced in about 250 workdays = about 1 calendar year. (Assuming the supplier was telling the truth ;))

J

PS a case in point is that my son bought an identical TomTom GPS and asked me if I'd had problems with my battery, because his died. I bought mine in 2005, always have it in the AC charge cradle (unless on a trip) and the battery never gets overcharged but it also never gets undercharged. And if I stop on the trip, I pop it in the carry case and take it with me. My son didn't keep his in the charger, it was always in the glove box until needed...so it gradually discharged very deeply = only good for a 'few'? cycles, plus, being left in the glove box, it got as cold or hot as the car did.
Another case was that I left my cell phone charging all the time when I was at home. The battery finally bulged to the point it popped the cover. I now have two batteries, I check their charge every month, if they drop a bar I charge them, haven't had a problem since.
Lastly, I bring my X6 dvr inside and occasionally check the battery level, popping in the USB cable when needed, which is seldom. I haven't had it very long, there may still be a surprise waiting for me some day. But by then Jokiin will have his cameras available...:)
 
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Why can't we build them like reverse cameras...
Camera eye bit on the windshield and cable all the way back to centre console or glovebox where everything else resides? Or attach body to visor.


Regards
Duke
That's called a Sports Cam or Helmet Cam. I'd still bring everything inside when I wasn't driving...
 
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