Dashcam Forum Relaunch

parklawn

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For those interested there will be an additional dashcam forum joining the ranks on Saturday, September 12.

Actually, it is a re-launch of the once-popular forum Car Cam Central at carcamcentral.com

It might be worth taking a look.
 
not sure how it will go, it never took of last time, they started at the same time and for some reason this forum got the traffic, they did suffer a lot of bot related spam on that forum which probably didn't help, maybe the forum software they use is more prone to the automated stuff
 
not sure how it will go, it never took of last time, they started at the same time and for some reason this forum got the traffic, they did suffer a lot of bot related spam on that forum which probably didn't help, maybe the forum software they use is more prone to the automated stuff

Not quite sure how to put it into words but the two forums had very different vibes when they started. DashCamTalk came across as more of an enthusiast's site with discussions of which color menu to look for on the venerable old GS1000 (orange!), how to avoid fakes and how to decide which Ali-Express merchant was worth taking a chance on. There were photos of dismantled cameras and talk of processors and other techy stuff for us DIY types. Car Cam Central, as well intentioned as it was seemed very focused on BlackVue at the time, the DVR-027 and not all that much else really. I kept hoping CCC might capture whatever spark it needed but it never quite seemed to happen.

Hopefully, the second time around will be the charm for Car Cam Central. I wish them luck. In fact, maybe they'll indirectly help DCT which in my view has gone way downhill since it has become quite so popular. It certain ways it is essentially now a marketing and affiliate link vehicle with an emphasis on "what should I buy?", heavy self promotion from certain vendors and developers, "help me fix my issue" threads and "informercial spam" reviews by willing members paid for with free cameras from retailers.
 
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growing pains that come with size and direction I guess, maybe they'll find a place although it seems to be kicking off again due to some affiliate type sponsorship so not sure how that will pan out, might just end up more a product placement and promotion thing also
 
growing pains that come with size and direction I guess, maybe they'll find a place although it seems to be kicking off again due to some affiliate type sponsorship so not sure how that will pan out, might just end up more a product placement and promotion thing also

I'm not sure how unbiased it will be either based on the front page affiliate announcement, and original reasons why the owner left last time. I'm not sure if the original conflict of interest still remains or if things are back to neutral for the relaunch.
 
and "informercial spam" reviews by willing members paid for with free cameras from retailers.

the Chinese sellers aren't great at creating content so giving out some cameras is a cheap way for them to get the content they need, pics, video samples, unboxing etc that they use in their online advertising, even if the reviews aren't great you still see them using them, reality of the way they do stuff I guess
 
I take reviews based on the reputation of the reviewer. If they have a visible bias, I discount that and all other reviews by them. I've seen many reviews of 'freebie' cams that were honest, so that alone doesn't carry with me so long as they make it clear up front. I will have a peek at the other place, but I have found no other forum on dashcams that has the knowledge and the good people which this one does so I'll likely hang around here as long as you will have me.

Wishing Car Cam Central well,
Phil
 
I don't want to derail this thread into a lengthy discussion of reviewers and their styles but certain "reviewers" here seem to think that making one or two minor criticisms of yet another free camera they've been sent along with mostly positiveness remarks, some generalized comments and lots of big, colorful manufacturer/vendor supplied advertising graphics and photos constitutes a legitimate "review". There is also more to a real review than posting some video examples and screen shots.

Just recently a newer member posted a simple, straightforward hands-on review that was so direct and honest and downright helpful and enlightening I was really impressed. It really gave the viewer a feel for what the camera is actually like to handle and use along with the pros and cons of what that means for the prospective buyer. It's what a "real" review should be all about and I hope to see more this kind of thing here on DCT rather than the "spam reviews" we see so much of. In addition, the manufacturer joined the discussion with extremely helpful, factual and very forthcoming commentary that only added to the quality and usefulness of the review as opposed to the usual cheerleading we see from certain vendors, one of whom specializes in handing out thousands of dollars worth of promotional cameras for "review". This particular review also included some comments and spectacular photo and video examples from the camera in question by another member that were also a welcome, worthwhile and useful addition that drew the review further away from feeling like a sales ruse, even if it might indeed help sell the camera.

Reviews of this nature can only add to DCT's credibility rather than detract from it as I believe the other sort of reviews we are seeing so much of are doing.
 
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Reviews of this nature can only add to DCT's credibility rather than detract from it as I believe the other sort of reviews we are see so much of are doing.

I agree, not sure if it's possible to separate the different types of reviews though, you can see it, I can see it, does the new user that arrives from a Google search looking for info for a first time purchase know the difference, probably not

I think it's kind of like one is a review, the other is an advertorial, in a lot of cases I wouldn't even say it's the reviewers fault directly, they get free product and I guess don't get too harsh in their criticism as a result, whether consciously or not I'm not sure in all cases. the lines are a bit blurred there sometimes
 
I agree, not sure if it's possible to separate the different types of reviews though, you can see it, I can see it, does the new user that arrives from a Google search looking for info for a first time purchase know the difference, probably not

I think it's kind of like one is a review, the other is an advertorial, in a lot of cases I wouldn't even say it's the reviewers fault directly, they get free product and I guess don't get too harsh in their criticism as a result, whether consciously or not I'm not sure in all cases. the lines are a bit blurred there sometimes

Every other forum I have ever been a member of other than DashCamTalk has a dedicated "review" section rather than allowing them to be posted anywhere and everywhere. Most forums have a special vendors forum for sales promotions that is always completely separate from the main discussion forums. More importantly, there are almost always specific guidelines and rules governing the general content of reviews. Also, NO other forum I am or have ever been a member of allows vendor links, affiliate links or discount codes to be included with a review. This way, objectivity can be maintained and no reviewer even has the possibility of appearing to be a shill or biased promoter . The review is supposed to be about the product itself not the sale of the product.

Here is a "borrowed" boiler plate example of what the guidelines often look like at other forums:

"Members who receive free products from a dealer or manufacturer for review purposes and post reviews in the proper forum are allowed and encouraged to add a single line down at the bottom of the review in regular font that has no link and no URL identifying the dealer or manufacturer who provided the product. For example, "Camera by X Company or X Vendor for review." Any further promotion of the company or links within the review thread will be removed. Dealers and manufacturers with the proper permissions to advertise in the appropriate forums may post a link to the review".
 
Every other forum I have ever been a member of other than DashCamTalk has a dedicated "review" section rather than allowing them to be posted anywhere and everywhere. Most forums have a special vendors forum for sales promotions that is always completely separate from the main discussion forums. More importantly, there are almost always specific guidelines and rules governing the general content of reviews. Also, NO other forum I am or have ever been a member of allows vendor links, affiliate links or discount codes to be included with a review. This way, objectivity can be maintained and no reviewer even has the possibility of appearing to be a shill or biased promoter . The review is supposed to be about the product itself not the sale of the product.

Here is a "borrowed" boiler plate example of what the guidelines often look like at other forums:

"Members who receive free products from a dealer or manufacturer for review purposes and post reviews in the proper forum are allowed and encouraged to add a single line down at the bottom of the review in regular font that has no link and no URL identifying the dealer or manufacturer who provided the product. For example, "Camera by X Company or X Vendor for review." Any further promotion of the company or links within the review thread will be removed. Dealers and manufacturers with the proper permissions to advertise in the appropriate forums may post a link to the review".

this is perhaps a good suggestion for @DashCamMan to maybe have a review section like this and the same sort of criteria, no discount codes etc, the site does get money from affiliate links on Amazon, eBay etc so I guess they are needed in part for the site to exist but perhaps something like Techmoan does, he does have links but he has multiple links so at least there's some choices offered and it's not just directed to a single sellers store, for the most part Techmoan buys the products himself though so not really the same situation

Not sure what the answer is but there is room for improvement I'm sure as the advertorials do seem to be growing
 
As the site grows I do think there needs to be some balance and perhaps a little discipline and restraint in how these reviews are approached.
 
As the site grows I do think there needs to be some balance and perhaps a little discipline and restraint in how these reviews are approached.

it has grown and it's probably time for a rethink on how best they should be presented so as not to hurt the credibility of the information here, there's plenty of good honest information but it can get hard to find when agendas get in the way, I would say in some cases the reviewers are not so much guilty themselves but in some instances have been played a bit
 
I don't want to derail this thread into a lengthy discussion of reviewers and their styles but certain "reviewers" here seem to think that making one or two minor criticisms of yet another free camera they've been sent along with mostly positiveness remarks, some generalized comments and lots of big, colorful manufacturer/vendor supplied advertising graphics and photos constitutes a legitimate "review". There is also more to a real review than posting some video examples and screen shots.
I also agreed with @jokiin, there's plenty of good honest information but it can get hard to find when agendas get in the way.

I think it is not a problem to offer free sample for reviewers, some good reputation reviewers don't join the affiliate program but provide professional and independent review.
I do expect see some bad points of every camera, if you really care the quality, it will help you to improve it.

Recently I watched a lot of reviews include GitUp and other cameras, in some reviews, I see every camera is perfect.
As @Dashmellow said: "There is also more to a real review than posting some video examples and screen shots."
 
it has grown and it's probably time for a rethink on how best they should be presented so as not to hurt the credibility of the information here, there's plenty of good honest information but it can get hard to find when agendas get in the way, I would say in some cases the reviewers are not so much guilty themselves but in some instances have been played a bit

Yes, I would agree with your remarks here. I think there are a number of things that could benefit from a rethinking here that are all basically related to marketing in one way or another. I've been thinking about this for awhile now and was actually planning to post about it elsewhere soon in a follow-up to another thread. Somehow, we've started talking some of the issues here though. This thread was really 'sposed to be about Car Cam Central's relaunch tomorrow.
 
even Techmoan's reviews are flawed, for the most part they (and others here) are not reviews, but product demonstrations, more of a walk through of the product, none are done over significant lengths of time, that's obviously not that practical anyway but how these product stack up over time is not something you can gather from any of these reviews
 
Don't get me started on Techmoan's flawed "reviews", opinions and the occasional misinformation he hands out. On the other hand I'm a fan of his and he performs a great service for the many of us fellow "moaners". I like that he has a consistent, disciplined approach to providing a good overview of many products and does it in a clear and entertaining manner. I've also enjoyed watching his video editing skills and the production value improve over time. He obviously puts a lot of time and effort into what he does. The thing with Techmoan is that he never comes across as a shill for a product.
 
Every other forum I have ever been a member of other than DashCamTalk has a dedicated "review" section rather than allowing them to be posted anywhere and everywhere. Most forums have a special vendors forum for sales promotions that is always completely separate from the main discussion forums. More importantly, there are almost always specific guidelines and rules governing the general content of reviews. Also, NO other forum I am or have ever been a member of allows vendor links, affiliate links or discount codes to be included with a review. This way, objectivity can be maintained and no reviewer even has the possibility of appearing to be a shill or biased promoter . The review is supposed to be about the product itself not the sale of the product.

Here is a "borrowed" boiler plate example of what the guidelines often look like at other forums:

"Members who receive free products from a dealer or manufacturer for review purposes and post reviews in the proper forum are allowed and encouraged to add a single line down at the bottom of the review in regular font that has no link and no URL identifying the dealer or manufacturer who provided the product. For example, "Camera by X Company or X Vendor for review." Any further promotion of the company or links within the review thread will be removed. Dealers and manufacturers with the proper permissions to advertise in the appropriate forums may post a link to the review".

Let me address your points:

1) Dedicated review section vs product / manufacturer forums. I have a personal preference of having all content from a particular manufacturer posted in its own section. I'll think about having a dedicated review section, but the counter side to that is information on a particular product will be posted in multiple spots. So the best review on a particular product won't even be in the section for that camera. I don't know what dash camera will become popular but usually a review starts and the thread grows very long. I typically split it off in a sub-forum at that point. In a forum with a dedicated section for reviews, helpful information on a camera will be split in multiple locations (huge review thread and subforum).

Take a look at the largest camera forum on the internet.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums
No dedicated review section, but sections for cameras. I would argue that there is a split between forums that offer a dedicated review forum vs including reviews in the relevant manufacturer section. Pros and cons for both. A dedicated review section isn't always the case or necessarily better.

2) We also have a special vendors forum for sales promotions completely separate from the main discussion forums. 1 thread per vendor. Unlike most forums that have paid sponsors, any manufacturer or retailer can post here. Not sure how unbiased a site is when there are a subset of paid sponsors.

3) Pretty much every review site (non forum) I have come across includes links (affiliate or non) with their reviews. For forums, I would argue most allow links as well. In the dash cam market, there is the unfortunate situation where the same camera model can be completely different internally (some sellers have multiple listings of the same model with different internals). Without indicating where that dash cam is purchased, there will be an increase in "I bought camera XYZ like your review but the quality is horrible". I have no problem with discount codes as well. If our members can save a few bucks, I don't see what the problem is.

Not sure how disallowing links will ensure "objectivity can be maintained and no reviewer even has the possibility of appearing to be a shill or biased promoter". If the reviewer still got the product for free, wouldn't they be biased to the same degree?

I googled that boiler plate example to see what another site is doing and came up with this forum (note I have not visited that site prior).
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/forum.php

Some observations:
1) 12 ads on the main page. Note that these are not Google Adsense ads (max of 3 per page) but bought directly from the site. The first question I would ask is there any special treatment for these paid advertisers. See their Ad policies here to see how much they are making
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/AdPolicies.html

2) Only lists 12 manufacturers in their commercial corner. Why so few. Check the Ad Policies again. To be listed there you need to spend $65 to $75 a month. If you don't pay the monthly fee, you can forget about selling or advertising your product there. And if you want a subforum you better have an "established relationship and reputation of good standing with CPF/CPFMP". Translation you should have paid your fees for a long time

3) I also like "Dealers and manufacturers with the proper permissions to advertise in the appropriate forums on CandlePowerForums.com may post a link to the review." So some people are allowed to post links in their reviews if they ponied up the cash for it

4) Fees for members as well. The more you pay the more you get.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/IconLegend1.html

5) They also appear to be charging for their classified / mall section

All that with a cursory look. I'm sure if I spent some time there I would see many other practices I would not be keen on.

Overall, the grass may not be greener on the other side.
 
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