A119S Firmware Bug Report

[jokiin]

If it were for playback only, I would have expected it to be written as: Adjusts the camera’s frequency setting to minimize flickering and banding during playback on AV port.
.

if it were for playback it has nothing to do with flicker, you would get a black and white picture on the AV output if the setting was incorrect, if for playback then it should mention PAL/NTSC mode

Either Viofo messed up both the menu setting in the camera and the description in the manual, or the setting isn't properly working as BCHobbyist reports.

hard to say as the test he did won't demonstrate the problem anyway as flicker would happen regardless of the setting when looking at LED lights, check under incandescent lighting to see if the frequency setting is working or not

 

[5Cowbells]

Sadly, I'm with BCHobbyist on this one 😳. The Viofo A119/S manual specifically says this about the Frequency setting:

What I stated in the referenced post is fact, not opinion. The AV output displays what's normally displayed on the LCD screen in real-time, playback, or menu, not just playback. In fact the LCD screen shuts off when the AV output is connected. Is it not possible for the Frequency setting to control more than one function? The common denominator is the 50 or 60 Hz power grid frequency.

 

[BCHobbyist]

The Frequency menu setting is used to control the format of composite video baseband TV signal output from the A119 AV port. 50Hz sets the AV output to PAL while 60Hz sets it to NTSC. This setting was fixed on A119 V2.0 firmware in November 2016. This function has been tested by me successfully on A119 V2.o and V3.3 firmware and A119S V2.0 (Beta) firmware, as I have an NTSC only TV.

Just tested 50/60Hz Frequency on A119S connected by AV out port to my 1080p NTSC display, using both 50/60Hz settings no image change was noticed which should have occurred.
For me this further confirms the FREQUENCY setting is non-functional and totally useless, only the manufacturer knows for sure.

 

[BCHobbyist]

if it were for playback it has nothing to do with flicker, you would get a black and white picture on the AV output if the setting was incorrect, if for playback then it should mention PAL/NTSC mode



hard to say as the test he did won't demonstrate the problem anyway as flicker would happen regardless of the setting when looking at LED lights, check under incandescent lighting to see if the frequency setting is working or not

as expected performed TEST (no guessing) under LED, incandescent, fluorescent, sunlight and candle light = 50/60Hz Frequency setting has zero effect, it is a BUG, I kill them.

 

[jokiin]

as expected performed TEST (no guessing) under LED, incandescent, fluorescent, sunlight and candle light = 50/60Hz Frequency setting has zero effect, it is a BUG, I kill them.

sunlight, candle light and LED light will have no difference regardless, if you don't see a difference when used under mains power incandescent or fluorescent lighting then that is an issue, nothing that can't be fixed though

 

[5Cowbells]

Just tested 50/60Hz Frequency on A119S connected by AV out port to my 1080p NTSC display, using both 50/60Hz settings no image change was noticed which should have occurred.
For me this further confirms the FREQUENCY setting is non-functional and totally useless, only the manufacturer knows for sure.

I tested both an A119 and A119S with a Sony NTSC only HDTV before my original post and the A119/A119S 50 and 60 Hz Frequency settings definitely display the AV image differently. At the 50Hz setting, the image is black and white and about 10-15% of the bottom part of the image is not displayed (looks like it continues off the bottom of the screen). Switch to the 60 Hz setting and the picture displays the normal size and in color. See the pictures below. One of my two Sony NTSC TVs can not obtain vertical sync at the 50 Hz setting so the picture rolls and displays in black and white. The vertical sync problem can be another symptom of a non-NTSC format signal being played on an NTSC only display. However, the TV synchronizes properly and the full image displays properly in color at the A119/A119S 60 Hz Frequency setting. Also in the past, I have also observed the differences in the two signals on an oscilloscope by measuring the duration of a field (one-half of an interlaced frame) for each case, i.e., the time between vertical sync pulses.

50 Hz setting:


60 Hz setting:

 

[jokiin]

So in other words the setting works but should be labelled as PAL/NTSC as it relates to the AV out function

 

[5Cowbells]

Yes, but there is a relationship to Frequency in that PAL is the analog TV standard for many countries that use 50 Hz power while NTSC is the analog TV standard for most countries that use 60 Hz power. Some late model TVs will play either analog format automatically, but the single format displays like mine are still out there. So the setting is a valid one, whatever you want to call it.

 

[jokiin]

Yes, but there is a relationship to Frequency in that PAL is the analog TV standard for many countries that use 50 Hz power while NTSC is the analog TV standard for most countries that use 60 Hz power. Some late model TVs will play either analog format automatically, but the single format displays like mine are still out there. So the setting is a valid one, whatever you want to call it.

wasn't saying the setting isn't valid, just that it is incorrectly named in the menu as the description doesn't match the function, PAL/NTSC and 50Hz/60Hz frequency setting are two independent functions, the 50Hz/60Hz frequency setting can be automated so can be done without there having to be a menu option to select one or the other, PAL/NTSC AV output has to be done manually so will require a menu selectable option

 

[Rocozaur]

The link posted goes to A119. I don't see the A119s on that link?

That's why I added the "/S". The manual linked is indeed the A119 but the A119S manual is virtually identical and everyone who got a good look at it can confirm that the Frequency paragraph is identical. Will take a picture later if you are still not convinced 🙂

5Cowbells and jokiin: Thank you for the extra clarifications. Will do some testing tonight myself since I do have some incandescent bulbs that haven't died yet back at home. Hard to find incadescent bulbs these days since Europe banned anything above 40W, and most of the streetlights are being converted to LEDs.

 

[BCHobbyist]

I tested both an A119 and A119S with a Sony NTSC only HDTV before my original post and the A119/A119S 50 and 60 Hz Frequency settings definitely display the AV image differently. At the 50Hz setting, the image is black and white and about 10-15% of the bottom part of the image is not displayed (looks like it continues off the bottom of the screen). Switch to the 60 Hz setting and the picture displays the normal size and in color. See the pictures below. One of my two Sony NTSC TVs can not obtain vertical sync at the 50 Hz setting so the picture rolls and displays in black and white. The vertical sync problem can be another symptom of a non-NTSC format signal being played on an NTSC only display. However, the TV synchronizes properly and the full image displays properly in color at the A119/A119S 60 Hz Frequency setting. Also in the past, I have also observed the differences in the two signals on an oscilloscope by measuring the duration of a field (one-half of an interlaced frame) for each case, i.e., the time between vertical sync pulses.

50 Hz setting:
View attachment 32822

60 Hz setting:
View attachment 32823

great information and testing, you have confirmed the A119/S - FREQUENCY - setting only applies to the dashcam's low resolution AV out port and has nothing to do with recorded video.
my 1080p NTSC test-bench monitor isn't old enough for 50/60Hz setting to have any effect, both show color and banding on incandescent, & fluorescent but worst on LED.

now i'm wondering if this setting has any affect when connecting A119/S to vehicles 6-10inch LCD screen?

 

[jokiin]

Most but not all LCD panels would automatically detect which standard the signal was and would just work regardless of the setting

 

[5Cowbells]

now i'm wondering if this setting has any affect when connecting A119/S to vehicles 6-10inch LCD screen?

If your display doesn't look just like the A119 LCD, then switch the A119 Frequency settings.

 

[Rocozaur]

And I'm back after conducting some tests with both of my Dash Cams. Let's begin. Uploaded as links on Gfycat, if anyone can help me embed them in the post, that would be great.

Flexmedia V737W 60Hz setting.
Viofo A119S 60Hz setting.

Flexmedia V737W 50Hz setting.
Viofo A119S 50Hz setting.

Both flicker at the 60Hz setting while there is barely any flicker at all at 50 Hz. Tested on an incandescent bulb on mains 220V/50Hz. Same bulb in both videos, that's how much of a difference there is between the 2 sensors, on the old Flexmedia you can distinguish where the bulb is, on the Viofo it turns into a ceiling sun [However this is an issue during night time recording, everything is blindingly bright especially the license plates. But more on that on the other topic of Firmware and Image Quality].

As such, on my limited sample of one Viofo A119S [V1.7 Firmware] the Frequency Setting is working as intended and described in the user manual. 🙂