Fake SDCards

I know the difference is 1 = 0.125 but the published requirement is 50Mbps write speed min.

I'll see what MediaInfo makes of it. ........

AiOZfhz.jpg


=

Format : MPEG-4
File size : 595 MiB
Duration : 5 min 0 s
Overall bit rate : 16.6 Mb/s






fiDVJzx.jpg


=

Format : MPEG-4
File size : 452 MiB
Duration : 3 min 1 s
Overall bit rate : 20.9 Mb/s
 
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I'm sure there is more to this than a simple lad like me can understand at the moment.

I'm just, wrongly, assuming that if the camera transfers a live 5 minute final 600Mb size recording then it's transferring a portion of the final size second by second.

At the time of recording it can't go into hyper transfer mode because it's a live recording so it's recording/saving 2Mb per second.

I'll go and have a lie down.
 
You are still getting your bits and bites and Mi and M mixed up Krem.
Bytes is a capital B as in MB/sec bits is a lower case b as in Mb/sec
M is base 10, Mi is based on the binary 2 ^ n

On your spreadsheet the Mb and Mb/s should be MB and MB/sec.
So your results are in MBytes which must be multiplied by 8 to get Megga bits (Mb)
so 2.5 MB/sec x 8 = 20Mb/sec, which is your highest transfer rate in bits per second. Still well within the 50Mb/s quotes as required, but not as well as you thought.
 
I see that but I'm failing to grasp the logic.

If you have 600 sweets and you need to take 5 minutes to transfer them to another jar then you need to move 2 sweets per second.

Whether it's sweets bytes or bits as long as it's like for like.

My problem is that I'm comparing my 600MB file with the 5 minutes required and ending up with 2MBps or 2MB/s.

My sdcard quotes MB/s in its advertising.

The result from my testing, covered in post 1 and copied directly from the output log, is:

Writing speed: 60.8 MByte/s (remember 60.8 MByte/s)*
Reading speed: 67.8 MByte/s

Note the output log capital B. According to my recent search, bits uses a lower case b

So my logic so far has been comparing MB with MB not Mb (my typo previously)


* So 60.8 MByte/s transfer speed for 5 minutes would be a total potential transfer of 18,240MB ?


So are some of the reported figures (Windows Explorer, SDCard transfer) Mb and not MB ?


All I know for sure is that my camera writes a ~600MB file every 5 minutes. So what is the exact calculation for working out what speed of card is required.
 
Transfer speed is obviously 2MB/sec so why do you need a 50MB/sec card. Hang on a mo, Krem just asked that.:eek:

I give in. Ask me one on F1.:hilarious:
 
:eek:

I'm going to test transfer my ~600MB file to the Sandisk card later using USB3 on the PC. My guess is that at the H2testw reported 18MBytes/s it should take circa 33 seconds ?

The dashcam has the luxury of having 5 minutes to stream this live video across.

So my maths is the Dashcam to card transfer, real time is:

~2MB/s which is ~16Mb/s - Bytes v bits



or, does the dashcam hold the file, partial file in internal memory until complete and push it across in less than 5 minutes ?
 
As we seem to have drifted off fakeness and into speediness, I thought that I would put my 5 eggs into the basket. I have a few micro SD Cards as shown below
SDCards.JPG
My BlackVue 750 2CH records 1 min clips with the front cam 1080@60fps and the rear cam 1080@30fps simultaneously.
The file sizes according to W10 file explorer are 98,500KB (front cam) and 83,940Kb (rear cam). This is a total of 182,340KB
The card that came with the cam is the BlackVue 16GB (#3) with a write speed of 43MB/s, and the one that I actually use is the Samsung Evo 128GB with a write speed of 70MB/s.

So, I said to myself, let's try a slower card and see what happens. I stuck in the Pitasoft 16GB (#2) card with a write speed of 10MB/s and guess what? It worked just fine and dandy with all recordings there and no drop out.
Now 182MB (approx) at 1 min record time would be a transfer rate of 3.05MB/s (about 25Mb/s), which of course is well lower then the 10MB/s of the card. So, no real surprises there then.
As this seems to be the case, why do cam manufacturers @Tiffany claim that you need a card with 50MB/s write speed?

@Tiffany. Whilst I was doing that, I also investigated my wife's NB 312 files the were recorded on the Kingston 32GB (#6) with a write speed of 9MB/s. When played back through Replay 3, they has momentary pauses in the playback as if data transfer was a problem (card reads at 28MB/s). However when played back through a couple of other viewers, there were no glitches at all. What's going on with RP3? Whilst I am on the subject of RP3, why does in not automagically list the files on the card when you stick it in the PC like the BlackVue viewer does? It's a pain in the butt having to go looking for the files.
 
I seem to have started something :unsure:. That's the problem with too much time on my hands.

That's a good point about RP3. Having to select each file individually rather than a directory then let it play one after the other.
 
I keep reading about frozen or problematic units. Something I've never experienced. All 3 of my Nextbase units have never missed a beat.

Looking back to the card I used in my 402, and initially the 412, that also had a dismal, sub 10MBp/s write speed but I never had any issues.

I wonder ...... if the problems arise when the situation occurs where older files are being overwritten and maybe protected files are in the mix ?

I've never had a full card where overwriting was imminent.
 
C'mon experts. There mus be someone who really knows what's going on rather than just having a wild guess or repeating the 'wisdom of the web'.
 
@Kremmen There are a couple of factors at play:

1) MB is Mega Bytes and Mb is Mega bits. The easiest way to remember is that you use the big B for Bytes, because Bytes are bigger than bits. There are 8 bits to a Byte. There are also 1024 Bytes to a Kilobyte, and 1024 KB to a MB, and 1024 MB to a GB (except if we're talking storage devices, which tend to use 1000 rather than 1024).

2) The bit rate (i.e. the rate at which the video is recorded to the card) is variable - and will depend on the complexity of the scene being recorded, and how effective the compression has been, frame by frame. This is always a compromise between bit-rate and quality - video compression is almost always 'lossy' - and while the algorithms are very very clever, they don't keep all of the available detail if the compression is too aggressive.

Hence your 596 MB recording example, over 300 seconds has an average write speed of 1.987 MB /s, which equates to 15.893 Mb /s *on average*

However - because the compression is variable, the peak bit rate can be higher than the average, and while in-memory buffering in the device smooths out write access to the sd card a little, it only goes so far. Which is why the manufacturers always recommend cards that can be written to with a degree of headroom above the average - sometimes 50% more, but to be on the safe side, maybe 100% more. If the card isn't fast enough, the camera may drop frames, or it may just fail to record at all, crash, or whatever else the programmer decided to do when the write buffer overflows.. a situation best avoided.

For what it's worth, an uncompressed 1920 x 1080 image, containing 8 bits per colour channel (i.e. 24 bits per pixel) contains 6,220,800 bytes of data. At 30 frames per second, that's 186,624,000 bytes per second. Over 300 seconds, that's 55,987,200,000 bytes … roughly 52 GB. It's only the advent of hardware based video compression that allows good quality video to be recorded at modest bit rates and in vastly smaller files.

So... what speed card do you need? A Class 10 card has to support a minimum of 10 MB /s write speed, and UHS Class 1 has to support a 10 MB /s write speed too. Minimum. A UHS Class 3 card must support a 30 MB /s write speed. Again, minimum. For most, a UHS Class 1 card will be fast enough in a dash camera. But for a 4K recording, or even a high frame rate 1440p recording, a UHS Class 3 card may be necessary - not for the 'average' write speed, but for the peak write speed. It gets even more fun when it comes to the internal architecture of the SD card, and the number of times blocks can be re-written before they are essentially 'worn out'. This is why some cards are not warrantied for use in dash cameras - not because they're not fast enough or large enough, but because they would 'wear out' too quickly for this kind of write/rewrite usage. Hence there are 'endurance' cards designed for more write/rewrite cycles. The downside is that they tend to be slower (or more expensive for the same speed).

Hope this helps.
 
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All makes perfect sense to me. Thanks.

What would be useful to know is roughly how many hours the non endurance cards are expected to last for. Obviously this will depend on card size and quality.

It may help those who are starting to notice recording issues decide whether their card is end of life.
 
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It may help those who are starting to notice recording issues decide whether their card is end of life.

they don't often show signs of degrading, when they fail it's just going to fail without warning, most people seem to work that out when they go to pull footage and find out there's nothing there, always best to replace cards at regular intervals as a preventative measure
 
Probably not helpful but I like to purchase 3 or 4 of the same branded sd cards & then swap them over regularly to hopefully pro long the life the span of the sd cards...
 
Not really that long Kremmen. For an endurance card, it can be rewritten between 1500 and 3000 times. For a normal card, more like 500 times. Recording Full HD, a 64GB endurance card may last about 400 days of continuous recording, or so. A standard card, 3 to 6 times less... and as Jokiin said, when they fail, they won’t give any warning. At best, they go to a “read only” mode.

... So how long a card lasts (in days) depends on how many hours it records for over that time, and whether it is an endurance (MLC) card, or a cheaper (TLC) card. If you drive only for a couple of hours a day, then even a standard card could last for years. However.... there is a reason I’m running a 128 GB endurance card :) I don’t want to take the chance that the one time I need a recording, I discover that I don’t have it..!
 
500 times is making sense for the failure posts we are getting.
 
I have just had a one of the recordings (Front and rear at the same time) from my Blackvue 750 fail. The BV viewer just bombs back to windows when I try to play them. However both front and rear play just fine in the Windows viewer.
The card is a Samsung Evo Plus128.
 
Strange. Must be some 'metadata' (or whatever) missing that Windows doesn't need.
 
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