Disappointed with Viofo for Abandoning A129 Duo Owners

[StrayCam]

You may want that g-sensor working properly while driving in case you are ever involved a serious accident, possibly knocked unconscious and/or transported to a hospital in an ambulance. It's an extra measure to help ensure that the dashcam marks that important recording as read-only so it does not overwrite it if no one else bothers to turn the ignition off before towing it away, or even if someone does turn the ignition off but you have a parking mode enabled, which may also overwrite that important recording. (This all assumes that the battery is still functional in the car after an accident of course.)

I certainly don't mind the g-sensor event getting locked while driving...; but the odds of everything happening such that I need it to prove I got broadsided by someone, or vice versa is not as likely to occur for me, as it would be that someone whacked my car while it was parked and drove off. - - If i could only have one of those features, I would choose "g-sensor in parking mode". You're likely to have zero witnesses while parked and more while driving...although I realize most witnesses disappear very quickly.

 

[jdct]

I certainly don't mind the g-sensor event getting locked while driving...; but the odds of everything happening such that I need it to prove I got broadsided by someone, or vice versa is not as likely to occur for me, as it would be that someone whacked my car while it was parked and drove off. - - If i could only have one of those features, I would choose "g-sensor in parking mode". You're likely to have zero witnesses while parked and more while driving...although I realize most witnesses disappear very quickly.

I hope you don't ever experience the circumstances which could make you think differently about this, because I would imagine that most people who end up in the hospital after a car accident, no matter on which floor, never thought they would ever possibly end up there. Even witnesses who remain on the scene are flawed because they are human; if there is more than one, you will invariably get more than one version of the story, often with conflicting recollections and assertions.

A friend of mine was sued for $5.5 million dollars for an accident while driving, with only $1 million umbrella policy coverage, and I was in the passenger seat. Neither of us thought that type of accident would occur either, but it did. And I ultimately had no choice but to sue him too, with his full approval because we were very good friends, for my resulting medical costs. If he had a dashcam (they were not available at the time), we would easily have been able to prove with certainty that the other driver ran a red light, because I saw ours switch to yellow after we entered the intersection. But of course, the other driver blamed him, and eyewitness reports were all over the place.

There is much randomness in life; you have considerably less control of the future that you may think -- though human beings need to feel as if they are in control in order to function so we lie to ourselves. (Is my memory correct about that traffic light being yellow? Who really knows, because I'm human and therefore flawed too.)

You could be the best driver on the road but it doesn't matter, because you're sharing that same road with every other possible type of driver.

 

[StrayCam]

I hope you don't ever experience the circumstances which could make you think differently about this, because I would imagine that most people who end up in the hospital after a car accident, no matter on which floor, never thought they would ever possibly end up there. Even witnesses who remain on the scene are flawed because they are human; if there is more than one, you will invariably get more than one version of the story, often with conflicting recollections and assertions.

A friend of mine was sued for $5.5 million dollars for an accident while driving, with only $1 million umbrella policy coverage, and I was in the passenger seat. Neither of us thought that type of accident would occur either, but it did. And I ultimately had no choice but to sue him too, with his full approval because we were very good friends, for my resulting medical costs. If he had a dashcam (they were not available at the time), we would easily have been able to prove with certainty that the other driver ran a red light, because I saw ours switch to yellow after we entered the intersection. But of course, the other driver blamed him, and eyewitness reports were all over the place.

There is much randomness in life; you have considerably less control of the future that you may think -- though human beings need to feel as if they are in control in order to function so we lie to ourselves. (Is my memory correct about that traffic light being yellow? Who really knows, because I'm human and therefore flawed too.)

I'm sorry to hear of your tragic accident. I realize that an accident can happen anywhere, anytime... I personally believe I'll have more of a need of someone whacking me while parked, rather than being in an accident where I'll need help deciphering who was as fault.

In any case, when I purchased the A129 I was told the dash cam would have both, g-sensor in driving & parking mode. So, I would be covered in either eventuality. But, the reality is the g-sensor in parking mode does not work yet; but it seems things may be getting corrected soon. I hope that's the case!

 

[jdct]

I'm sorry to hear of your tragic accident. I realize that an accident can happen anywhere, anytime... I personally believe I'll have more of a need of someone whacking me while parked, rather than being in an accident where I'll need help deciphering who was as fault.

The accident was not at all tragic for me; that was not the point of relating the story.

In any case, when I purchased the A129 I was told the dash cam would have both, g-sensor in driving & parking mode. So, I would be covered in either eventuality. But, the reality is the g-sensor in parking mode does not work yet; but it seems things may be getting corrected soon. I hope that's the case!

Well, you're right on that one.

 

[TonyM]

You may want that g-sensor working properly while driving in case you are ever involved a serious accident, possibly knocked unconscious and/or transported to a hospital in an ambulance. It's an extra measure to help ensure that the dashcam marks that important recording as read-only so it does not overwrite it if no one else bothers to turn the ignition off before towing it away, or even if someone does turn the ignition off but you have a parking mode enabled, which may also overwrite that important recording. (This all assumes that the battery is still functional in the car after an accident of course.)

I can't find the thread now, but we did have a police officer on the forum a while ago who described that exact scenario. He explained that he always enables the g-sensor for driving, to make sure that the point of impact is not overwritten by loop recording if the camera is hardwired. Until I read his posts I used to disable my g-sensor, but now I have it enabled on all my cameras.

 

[jdct]

I can't find the thread now, but we did have a police officer on the forum a while ago who described that exact scenario. He explained that he always enables the g-sensor for driving, to make sure that the point of impact is not overwritten by loop recording if the camera is hardwired. Until I read his posts I used to disable my g-sensor, but now I have it enabled on all my cameras.

Also worth noting is that in many cases during one of the three major forces experienced during an auto collision, a cigarette lighter style power adapter can easily pop out of the outlet receptacle, potentially stopping video recording early.

And, even if you tap into 12v constant power at the fusebox, some modern cars automatically cut power to many circuits when a significant collision is detected.

So if it is your desire to record what happens for some period of time after the point of impact, you will need to tap the battery power before any power management system, and use your own time delay relay circuit on the ignition powered wire for hardwire power adapters. Just determine in advance what you want your dashcam to do in such an event and then make it happen, fully hoping that you will never need it to.

 

[TonyM]

Also worth noting is that in many cases during one of the three major forces experienced during an auto collision, a cigarette lighter style power adapter can easily pop out of the outlet receptacle, potentially stopping video recording early.

What do you mean by 'early'? In the event of external power loss, capacitor-based cameras should maintain enough charge to stop the current recording and save the last file before shutting down properly, so the actual collision will be recorded.

 

[jdct]

What do you mean by 'early'? In the event of external power loss, capacitor-based cameras should maintain enough charge to stop the current recording and save the last file before shutting down properly, so the actual collision will be recorded.

Consider the case of a multiple vehicle collision on the highway/motorway. Not only may your car hit another car, but then your car may be hit again by another car after that initial event, and possibly even thrust into another car. (Think rain and fog conditions. I'd say snow/ice too, but you're apparently in UK.) Also while at highway speed when multiple impacts can occur even in only single car accident events, if the first impact knocks the cigarette-lighter power wire loose, then the dashcam will be saving files and shutting down during any subsequent impacts. (And it may do the same anyway if the battery is damaged at any significantly serious impact point preceding another, or even more commonly if the car is of the type to disable fused power circuits after a severe impact (as an anti-fire mechanism in the case of fuel spills. Wiring directly to the battery, fusing separately of course, and making accommodation for a dashcam switched power delay off after ignition off, thereby bypassing that power control circuitry can help to avoid that potential issue.) And if after all impacts are over if someone is not thinking clearly and chooses to come toward your car with a weapon, or simply acts like a raging a-hole in some other manner, then you'll be able to prove that too.

After a rare occurrence, many people will ask something to the effect of, "yeah but what were the odds of that happening?", my response to them will almost always be a snarky "100%" because it just happened. And then a, "Didn't you just see it?"

 

[joe384]

Consider the case of a multiple vehicle collision on the highway/motorway. Not only may your car hit another car, but then your car may be hit again by another car after that initial event, and possibly even thrust into another car. (Think rain and fog conditions. I'd say snow/ice too, but you're apparently in UK.) Also while at highway speed when multiple impacts can occur even in only single car accident events, if the first impact knocks the cigarette-lighter power wire loose, then the dashcam will be saving files and shutting down during any subsequent impacts. (And it may do the same anyway if the battery is damaged at any significantly serious impact point preceding another, or even more commonly if the car is of the type to disable fused power circuits after a severe impact (as an anti-fire mechanism in the case of fuel spills. Wiring directly to the battery, fusing separately of course, and making accommodation for a dashcam switched power delay off after ignition off, thereby bypassing that power control circuitry can help to avoid that potential issue.) And if after all impacts are over if someone is not thinking clearly and chooses to come toward your car with a weapon, or simply acts like a raging a-hole in some other manner, then you'll be able to prove that too.

After a rare occurrence, many people will ask something to the effect of, "yeah but what were the odds of that happening?", my response to them will almost always be a snarky "100%" because it just happened. And then a, "Didn't you just see it?"

So you put a bigger battery / super-capacitor in the dashcam so it can run for longer after power loss?
Batteries and Super Caps are already quite big compared to the overall size of dashcams, so what do you do... Have an external power pack? There's a chance that might get knocked out as well. The last accident my brother had his dashcam actually got knocked off the windscreen by the force (it still stayed on long enough for the file to be saved though)

The chances are the first impact will have evidence of who caused it. If you try keeping the dashcam running longer (in the hope you might catch something else) you run the risk of it losing all power (and not writing the file correctly) or the dashcam being knocked off the windscreen.

I think what manufacturers do currently is probably the best solution (I actually think it's impossible for any solution to cover all cases)

 

[kamkar]

Well i could see a accident and following that a case where you would want to record after the initial crash as subsequent drivers drive reckless and dangerous.
And you would want that to be filmed too.
So unless you are knocked out or worse killed, you would want to check the state of your cameras after a event.
When i was rear ended i did not turn of my car, as there might still be things to film, but if it is big / bad you might not be all that cool calm and collective.

I guess that's just another reason why dashcams are not set and forget.

 

[jdct]

So you put a bigger battery / super-capacitor in the dashcam so it can run for longer after power loss?

The manufacturers will not put more expensive parts into their dashcams when only 5% of purchasers will notice any difference. Besides, dashcams already assume loss of power as a signal that the owner does not want it to record any longer.

Batteries and Super Caps are already quite big compared to the overall size of dashcams, so what do you do... Have an external power pack? There's a chance that might get knocked out as well. The last accident my brother had his dashcam actually got knocked off the windscreen by the force (it still stayed on long enough for the file to be saved though)

Wiring the constant power wire directly to the car battery and utilizing and an independent time-delay-off relay for switched power wire adequately addresses the situation -- for now at least. It would be a 'nice to have' option built into future dashcams, but I'm not holding my breath.

The chances are the first impact will have evidence of who caused it. If you try keeping the dashcam running longer (in the hope you might catch something else) you run the risk of it losing all power (and not writing the file correctly) or the dashcam being knocked off the windscreen.

As you pointed out earlier in this same post, the super-capacitors are already located within the dashcam itself and memory cards are solid state, not mechanical, so it will save as much as it can possibly save given the conditions presented -- which will in many cases be longer than if operating solely with a cigarette lighter power supply which might be ejected upon impact, and so on.

I think what manufacturers do currently is probably the best solution (I actually think it's impossible for any solution to cover all cases)

We all have the right to believe what whatever we wish. "Wishful thinking" would not be a well known phrase if it was not common. And some of you reading this are probably thinking something to the effect of "yes, but what are the chances of that happening?" Underlying my more snarky response above, the answer is probably "much more likely than you think" especially if you don't account for the possibility in advance and plan for it.

Also, I like having my dashcam continuing to record in full speed and resolution while I or my family members are walking away from the car after leaving it, as it can help to protect me in those cases too, or at least help investigators find whoever ran me over and killed me -- and also whether they cared enough to back up and run over me again to ensure that they got the job done.

 

[jdct]

Well i could see a accident and following that a case where you would want to record after the initial crash as subsequent drivers drive reckless and dangerous.
And you would want that to be filmed too.
So unless you are knocked out or worse killed, you would want to check the state of your cameras after a event.
When i was rear ended i did not turn of my car, as there might still be things to film, but if it is big / bad you might not be all that cool calm and collective.

I guess that's just another reason why dashcams are not set and forget.

I have been meaning to install a separate activation button in my car that would power on the dashcams for set amount of time even if the ignition is not on, and I had also wanted to add a trigger to begin recording when I unlock my car with the remote from afar, but I have not yet gotten around to installing either of those features. In the case of a police stop, they will often enough make a demand to "turn off the vehicle."

 

[kamkar]

I have been thinking, as mentioned with the modern cars and their auto cut of power, maybe hard wire kits should have 2 wires ( 4 in total ), so you have 2 second chance of getting power if you have connected one of the + wires to a circuit that get cut.
But as my mind are a raging torrent of entropy most of the time i have forgotten it again.

And it would probably also complicate things, this spring i moved my friends dashcam to his MERC, and i have no idea what happened but installing the 2 wires ( not hard wire kit ) not least finding a ACC wire was a major problem, and TBH i think that car have a lot of things live for a long time, cuz when i finally found a wire, it was one that was always live before, so i figure it finally timed out.
So a 1 hour job turned into a 2 hour job, and i am glad mu very impatient friend dident try that himself or he would have torched his "new" car. the guy do really not good when things don't go his way, and he are not all that tech savvy.

 

[jdct]

I have been thinking, as mentioned with the modern cars and their auto cut of power, maybe hard wire kits should have 2 wires ( 4 in total ), so you have 2 second chance of getting power if you have connected one of the + wires to a circuit that get cut.

I don't think they will ever do that because we can just tap battery before car's power management system. Besides, we don't really need to use the manufacturer supplied hardwire kit anyway, as long as we know the voltage and current requirements for the dashcam input cable pins. So it's probably just easier to create your own power adapter with easily override-enabled low-voltage cutoff. Or perhaps there is opportunity for a third party to make a much better product, maybe even with an extra bank of super-capacitors, good for at least some extra seconds recording time in the case of accident caused car battery damage or otherwise.

 

[jokiin]

The manufacturers will not put more expensive parts into their dashcams when only 5% of purchasers will notice any difference.

cost is irrelevant, bigger capacitors would make no difference so it's not a solution anyway, needs a power source independent of the cars electrical system to do what you want

 

[Harsh]

Best bet would be a 2 wire kit connected direct to the battery.

 

[Nigel]

Best bet would be a 2 wire kit connected direct to the battery.

Not sure that even that works on a BMW?
They have explosives in their battery terminals to make absolutely sure the battery is disconnected in a crash!
Plus they are quite likely to declare a service is necessary if they see the battery appearing to self-discharge.

 

[jokiin]

Cellink Neo or similar is maybe the best solution, not cheap though

 

[Harsh]

Not sure that even that works on a BMW?
They have explosives in their battery terminals to make absolutely sure the battery is disconnected in a crash!
Plus they are quite likely to declare a service is necessary if they see the battery appearing to self-discharge.

Ya, didn't think of that. Had a simpler car like mine in mind.

As jokiin mentioned, a battery pack (probably in the boot) sounds like a better option.

 

[Nigel]

As jokiin mentioned, a battery pack (probably in the boot) sounds like a better option.

Or don't buy a BMW