Expensive dashcams worth it?

[jokiin]

Q. Why are none of the premium dashcams listed on the best buy page? The only brand name camera listed is a Garmin 55.
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define which premium dashcam you feel is missing?

 

[RLS]

define which premium dashcam you feel is missing?

Haha... the list would be extremely lengthy if I were to chime in [emoji23]...

TBH, I don’t consider any of the dashcams that BestBuy sells... as “premium” dashcams. At best, maybe mid-range... except F800.


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[Blink982]

define which premium dashcam you feel is missing?

I have no idea, it is why I am trying to establish if it is worth spending 300-400GBP on one versus 50-150GBP. The installer I linked to in my original post stocks Blackvue and Qvia models and tends to fit them in premium cars. Why is that? (just being curious).

All of the dashcams on the home page of this site are all relatively affordable models e.g. B1W, Viofo, SG, hence my original question.

Haha... the list would be extremely lengthy if I were to chime in [emoji23]...

TBH, I don’t consider any of the dashcams that BestBuy sells... as “premium” dashcams. At best, maybe mid-range... except F800.


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Sorry, when I typed "best buy" (It was a link to the page on this site, not the US store) I forgot you guys have a shop called Best Buy!

 

[Nigel]

Here is a low speed clip from a friend:
[MEDIA]

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Sounds like radio reception issues to me rather than the camera.

Too much bass can cause video and audio issues for any camera when the glass it is attached to starts vibrating, but it appears to be coping in that video.

 

[RLS]

Sounds like radio reception issues to me rather than the camera.

Too much bass can cause video and audio issues for any camera when the glass it is attached to starts vibrating, but it appears to be coping in that video.

Well, i don’t get those issues even tho my Spotify playlist contains many bass heavy songs.

For me, I personally noticed more vibration from drone/loud exhaust on my cars. But nowhere near the same extent as in the above video.


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[Nigel]

Q. Why are none of the premium dashcams listed on the best dashcams of 2018 page? The only brand name camera listed is a Garmin 55.

I'm not too fussed about audio. I have action cameras to use if I want to film a road trip.

On this website, Viofo, Street Guardian, Blueskysea, Mini etc. are considered brand names of dashcam manufacturers, they are the companies that make most of the dashcams sold to the website members. All of them also participate on this website, send out samples for testing/review, and listen to feedback so that we get the features we want and problems are fixed.

Not sure what you consider a brand name, but Xiaomi is on the Best Dash Cam page, "the world's most valuable privately held company, and its third biggest smartphone maker".

The "300-400GBP" dashcams are probably not in the list because few people post about them and the Best Dash Cam list is based on what people post. But they also tend not to be what most people want, often a bit behind on technology while companies like Viofo who listen to what website members want are the ones leading the technology. The cheaper cameras, like the most expensive, are often behind on technology and will use older image sensors and batteries instead of super capacitors etc., the B1W being an exception which is why it is popular.

I do not think it worth spending "300-400GBP" unless they can provide some feature that you really want and which isn't available on cheaper cameras, but I'm not sure what that feature would be since some of the mid range cameras do give most people what they want, except where it is not technically possible yet. Spending £150 rather than £50 will get you a better low light sensor and generally better build quality, although build quality of the B1W seems pretty good to me and so far reliability also seems good.

If it is purely an accident camera then you should think of it as insurance, it's an investment that will hopefully pay for itself eventually, a very low light sensor that has more chance of capturing a number plate may be worth having, a buffered parking mode (as on the current expensive cameras) with a sensor that can miss someone spraying paint on your car might not be as good as a low frame rate parking mode (as on A129, B1W etc.) that captures everything, but might miss the critical frame containing the number plate after someone knocks off your door mirror and then speeds away.

 

[Nigel]

Well, i don’t get those issues even tho my Spotify playlist contains many bass heavy songs.

For me, I personally noticed more vibration from drone/loud exhaust on my cars. But nowhere near the same extent as in the above video.


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All cars are different, the windscreen in a Lotus Elise which uses the thinnest, lightest glass possible and is mounted purely to remain in place will behave very differently to the windscreen in a Porsche which is pretty heavy and mounted to provide a lot of the torsional rigidity of the car. Then the speakers may or may not be capable of producing sound frequencies that match the resonant frequency of the glass. Same for the exhaust, a well tuned exhaust will avoid any of the resonant frequencies of the car cabin and its components. A "general purpose" dashcam can't however be tuned for the car, if your car has droning issues then that is an issue with the car, not the dashcam!

 

[RLS]

All cars are different, the windscreen in a Lotus Elise which uses the thinnest, lightest glass possible and is mounted purely to remain in place will behave very differently to the windscreen in a Porsche which is pretty heavy and mounted to provide a lot of the torsional rigidity of the car. Then the speakers may or may not be capable of producing sound frequencies that match the resonant frequency of the glass. Same for the exhaust, a well tuned exhaust will avoid any of the resonant frequencies of the car cabin and its components. A "general purpose" dashcam can't however be tuned for the car, if your car has droning issues then that is an issue with the car, not the dashcam!

Ugh, in an effort not to get too technical in physics/mechanics (tbh, I don’t mind falling back on my engineering degree...but...), since I don’t think it helps much compared to real-world usage...

Alright then, since you are confident in what you claim, I decided to disassemble a brand new A129 duo I have sitting around, in an effort of constructive criticism:

- brand new, just opened.

-remove the GPS mount and 4x screws

-notice the way the mic is wired...? Lol

-yellow circle: clearly indicates wiring for remote mic
-blue arrows: points at the foam that’s underneath the mic unit (in green), which is held against the foam by some tape that mainly holds the wires up against the mSD Card tray.

**** Feel free to disassemble your own A129 duo to verify ****

Now, I’ll admit that I don’t have an Elise, or know of anyone that would let me test in one, but I have installed dashcams in a wide range of cars... from economical cars to sports cars to exotics to hyper cars.

As for the car in the video I provided, it is a GTR, which I also own one (which is why I use the SG in mine instead). Both of our cars have very high quality, aftermarket exhaust systems from reputable brands. My exhaust is louder than his (I run a 4inch midpipe to 4inch valvetronic exhaust).

I have installed and tested the A129, with similar results as the above video in: Hellcat, C7 vette, the GTR in the video, another friend’s GTR, Panamera, Macan, new gen Civic, a couple Infiniti’s...



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[RLS]

On this website, Viofo, Street Guardian, Blueskysea, Mini etc. are considered brand names of dashcam manufacturers, they are the companies that make most of the dashcams sold to the website members. All of them also participate on this website, send out samples for testing/review, and listen to feedback so that we get the features we want and problems are fixed.

Not sure what you consider a brand name, but Xiaomi is on the Best Dash Cam page, "the world's most valuable privately held company, and its third biggest smartphone maker".

The "300-400GBP" dashcams are probably not in the list because few people post about them and the Best Dash Cam list is based on what people post. But they also tend not to be what most people want, often a bit behind on technology while companies like Viofo who listen to what website members want are the ones leading the technology. The cheaper cameras, like the most expensive, are often behind on technology and will use older image sensors and batteries instead of super capacitors etc., the B1W being an exception which is why it is popular.

Mini? Have you perused the threads for most of the cameras? They all have difficulty in hot weather, subpar audio, lens distortion (then they released the mini 2p), the Mini3 is a pain to get footage off of, etc. And yes, I have at least one of each lol.

Xiaomi dashcam is terrible in warm weather.

Not to knock on VIOFO too hard (I have multiple of each A series cam)... but in regards to “listening to website members”.... tell me what happened with the WR-1...? LOL. Mine, and many others’, are no longer in use. And most requests for help/fixes... yea... feel free to check that thread.

I’ll only fully agree with your above state on Street Guardian dashcams in general. They are the quickest to remedy issues, have the absolute best customer support (jokiin), the most reliable hot temperature operation, etc. Of course, SG products are priced higher, even to the *seemingly* comparable products released by other manufacturers. But the quality of parts (lens, lens holder, housing material, etc), firmware updates, support, etc, are so far unmatched.


No dashcam is without its pros and cons, and no manufacturer releases a perfect product. But as with all things, a “race to the bottom” usually leads to lower QC/QA, cheaper components, less support, less updates, etc.


Since I have way too many dashcams, and friends/family that don’t mind spending more for the dashcam setups I help them with as a hobby, I won’t mind providing feedback on more of the “300-400GBP” dashcams. I prioritize 24/7 reliability, with ability to run in hot temperatures in parking mode. I don’t mind spending the money to research the absolute best products to protect my cars, other car enthusiasts cars, and friends&family’s cars.

The dashcams also help deal with tickets/citations, deter people from damaging your car while in parking mode, and seem to hold up pretty well in court.




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[RLS]

And, since I just so happen to have a new, extra SG9663DC:

- red circle: mic unit on PCB




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[Nigel]

-notice the way the mic is wired...? Lol
-yellow circle: clearly indicates wiring for remote mic
-blue arrows: points at the foam that’s underneath the mic unit (in green), which is held against the foam by some tape that mainly holds the wires up against the mSD Card tray.

**** Feel free to disassemble your own A129 duo to verify ****

I'm not sure what your point is, maybe you could explain?

In a cheap dashcam I would expect to see a surface mount or through mount mic on the PCB, however you show that the A129 (B1W too) has a wired mic to isolate it from vibrations in the PCB (mainly coming through the mount) and also to allow it to be positioned away from the inductors and ceramic capacitors on the PCB which produce nasty audible hissing/squeeking background noises on many of the lesser and quite a few of the better dashcams and action cameras. Many people get annoyed by those "electronic" high frequency noises on the soundtrack. I also note that it has metal shielding underneath (the SD slot casing) to shield the most sensitive part of the audio circuit from electronic noise, and it has a decent space and nice open air vent/grill just above it so that it can pic up decent sound from inside the car's cabin instead of the muffled audio we hear on many of the cheaper and more expensive cameras. OK, it doesn't point towards the two little holes that are labled "Mic" on the outside of the case, but trying to use those tiny holes for good audio probably wouldn't work too well anyway, the mic would need to be pushed up against them and then it would be affected by vibrations in the case. What matters is the audio quality, and until your comment above, the only complaint I'd heard about that was that one of the reviews said it was too good! Not sure why the foam is needed, but presumably it is there to absorb unwanted noise, or possibly to remove a resonance inside the casing, or maybe it is just something for the mic to rest against to isolate it from vibrations coming through the car chassis, then body, then glass, and into the dashcam mount.

 

[Nigel]

And, since I just so happen to have a new, extra SG9663DC:
- red circle: mic unit on PCB




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Now that is exactly what I wouldn't want to see, the mic mounted directly on the PCB with no vibration isolation, a possibly noisy ceramic capacitor right next to it, no easy way for the cabin sound to get to the microphone and nothing that would obviously reduce audio resonance within the case! At least it appears to be positioned away from the power supply electronics

I wonder why the speaker has wires to it, a simple PCB mount speaker should be fine, we don't need the best sound reproduction within a dashcam?

 

[Nigel]

Mini? Have you perused the threads for most of the cameras? They all have difficulty in hot weather, subpar audio, lens distortion (then they released the mini 2p), the Mini3 is a pain to get footage off of, etc. And yes, I have at least one of each lol.

Xiaomi dashcam is terrible in warm weather.

Not to knock on VIOFO too hard (I have multiple of each A series cam)... but in regards to “listening to website members”.... tell me what happened with the WR-1...? LOL. Mine, and many others’, are no longer in use. And most requests for help/fixes... yea... feel free to check that thread.

I’ll only fully agree with your above state on Street Guardian dashcams in general. They are the quickest to remedy issues, have the absolute best customer support (jokiin), the most reliable hot temperature operation, etc. Of course, SG products are priced higher, even to the *seemingly* comparable products released by other manufacturers. But the quality of parts (lens, lens holder, housing material, etc), firmware updates, support, etc, are so far unmatched.


No dashcam is without its pros and cons, and no manufacturer releases a perfect product. But as with all things, a “race to the bottom” usually leads to lower QC/QA, cheaper components, less support, less updates, etc.


Since I have way too many dashcams, and friends/family that don’t mind spending more for the dashcam setups I help them with as a hobby, I won’t mind providing feedback on more of the “300-400GBP” dashcams. I prioritize 24/7 reliability, with ability to run in hot temperatures in parking mode. I don’t mind spending the money to research the absolute best products to protect my cars, other car enthusiasts cars, and friends&family’s cars.

The dashcams also help deal with tickets/citations, deter people from damaging your car while in parking mode, and seem to hold up pretty well in court.




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Wrong Mini, I was thinking of the mini 0906.
And I never suggested that the Xiaomi dash cameras are good, although one does appear on the "Best Dash Cams" page!

 

[RLS]

I'm not sure what your point is, maybe you could explain?

In a cheap dashcam I would expect to see a surface mount or through mount mic on the PCB, however you show that the A129 (B1W too) has a wired mic to isolate it from vibrations in the PCB (mainly coming through the mount) and also to allow it to be positioned away from the inductors and ceramic capacitors on the PCB which produce nasty audible hissing/squeeking background noises on many of the lesser and quite a few of the better dashcams and action cameras. Many people get annoyed by those "electronic" high frequency noises on the soundtrack. I also note that it has metal shielding underneath (the SD slot casing) to shield the most sensitive part of the audio circuit from electronic noise, and it has a decent space and nice open air vent/grill just above it so that it can pic up decent sound from inside the car's cabin instead of the muffled audio we hear on many of the cheaper and more expensive cameras. OK, it doesn't point towards the two little holes that are labled "Mic" on the outside of the case, but trying to use those tiny holes for good audio probably wouldn't work too well anyway, the mic would need to be pushed up against them and then it would be affected by vibrations in the case. What matters is the audio quality, and until your comment above, the only complaint I'd heard about that was that one of the reviews said it was too good! Not sure why the foam is needed, but presumably it is there to absorb unwanted noise, or possibly to remove a resonance inside the casing, or maybe it is just something for the mic to rest against to isolate it from vibrations coming through the car chassis, then body, then glass, and into the dashcam mount.

Sigh. Just go open up your own. You are stubbornly persistent. Your observations are alright I guess. Yes, the sound is “decent” on the A129 duo, and if your car has soft/regular suspension/dampeners, and is relatively quiet, then sure, no issues with audio. My response about audio was to the OP, who has a sporty car with PASM and the stock exhaust is pretty loud.


Anyways: no. There is no shielding between as card slot. Yes, it has a remote mic unit. Not the best solder, thin wires, and then taped to the shield. Feel free to check the quality of your own. As for the foam, it’s pretty cheap, and the mic unit isn’t even held down by the tape (the wires are), so the unit can easily “bounce” around on the foam.

As for the mic on the PCB for the SG, it’s definitely doing something right lol. It’s not just two point soldered; it’s an enclosed unit.

Here is the mic from a F800 pro:

The mic on the F800 pro gets so much noisy/interference in the audio. I tried high fidelity windscreen foam and vibration dampers, but it still had the worst audio among $300+ dashcams lol.


Have you even used other dashcams personally? One reviewer saying it’s too good... in relation to what?

Your visual analysis is all in theory. Have you ever worked in the consumer electronics industry? Everything can seem great on paper, but how often does that follow through to real-world performance? As for me, I used to work in R&D for a world renowned audio consumer electronics company. Which is why I throughly test, disassemble, modify, etc, rather than sit back and visually analyze


Anyways, lemme find a video from my SG, with my louder exhaust, windows down.


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[RLS]

Wrong Mini, I was thinking of the mini 0906.
And I never suggested that the Xiaomi dash cameras are good, although one does appear on the "Best Dash Cams" page!

Mini 0906? I have one of those too LOL. Have you read the amazon reviews for it? How about the mount issues with most Mini cameras? Definitely go take a look.

Sigh. You really need to try some other dashcams, along with taking all the reviews on this forum, on Amazon, etc, with a grain of salt (as you do so with mine).

Many reviewers compare dashcams that the manufacturers provide them, whether it be here or Amazon lol. As for me, I have purchased every dashcam to date, with my own money. I have no reason to be biased. I just compare for myself, take things apart (habit of mine; I used to specialize in reverse engineering lol), test in various vehicles, and test multiple dashcams in each vehicle lol.


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[RLS]

Found some clips. All from my SG9663DC.

All of these are windows down, in my GTR, with pretty loud exhaust... with other cars being even louder:

- heavily modded Mustang GT

- whipple Supercharged CTS-V straight-piped at ~800whp

-same as above, from highway speeds roll (windows down still), you can hear the whine of the SC, etc.



Yes, at full throttle, I do get a bit of interference, but it’s nowhere near as bad as the first video I posted.


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[RLS]

Here’s a clip from the DR750S that I used to run. The other two cars are ridiculously loud. Notice that as I slow down, the bumps in the road cause interference in the audio.

- Aventador vs. Nismo GTR


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[Nigel]

Sigh. Just go open up your own. You are stubbornly persistent. Your observations are alright I guess. Yes, the sound is “decent” on the A129 duo, and if your car has soft/regular suspension/dampeners, and is relatively quiet, then sure, no issues with audio. My response about audio was to the OP, who has a sporty car with PASM and the stock exhaust is pretty loud.
...

One reviewer saying it’s too good... in relation to what?

A129 review containing "the audio is very good (almost too good!)": https://dashcamtalk.com/forum/threads/viofo-a129-duo-my-opinion.34791/

Have you ever worked in the consumer electronics industry?

No, last electronics I designed went in a Formula One car.

Have you even used other dashcams personally?

A few, although not the $300 catagory.

The mic on the F800 pro gets so much noisy/interference in the audio.

Not surprised, another board mounted mic, but this time probably pressed up against the case wall with a tiny mic hole in it.

thin wires,

You only need thin wires for a mic, they produce close to zero current.

and then taped to the shield

Good way of isolating it acoustically, you don't want it firmly attached so that it picks up all the vibrations.

As for the foam, it’s pretty cheap, and the mic unit isn’t even held down by the tape (the wires are),

Yes, don't want those vibrations to be transferred into the mic itself, best to hold the wires, the foam just has to do it's job, maybe cheap is fine.

and if your car has soft/regular suspension/dampeners, and is relatively quiet, then sure, no issues with audio. My response about audio was to the OP, who has a sporty car with PASM and the stock exhaust is pretty loud.

No, my car has springs and dampers developed for the race track. "relatively quiet" - relative to yours yes, but yours would be illegal here, even on the race track! The OP's car sounds like an unmodified production car to me and will have to comply with Euro regulations for sound etc. so will be significantly quieter than mine.

Anyways, lemme find a video from my SG, with my louder exhaust, windows down.

Everything has it's limits, and it seems you have found them!

I suggest you replace the mic with a low sensitivity unit if you want to record those sound levels, much easier with an A129 than that SG since the A129 has a wired mic rather than a surface mount one - replacing it will be easy

 

[country_hick]

BestBuy doesn’t sell premium dashcams except the F800 (non-pro). I wouldn’t recommend buying a dashcam from them. Most of the dashcams they sell aren’t even capacitor based.

Action cams are good, but have their limitations. They tend to overheat. Just don’t expect any action cam to be able to record non-stop, even with wire to battery pack. They all have max operating temp around 140F lol.

The mobius cams tend to record hour after hour without issue. Although originally designed as an action cam once a supercapacitor was installed the mobius have worked for years while recording hours of video each day.

 

[RLS]

I would say that my car is quieter than a stock Hellcat, Aventador, 488, etc, all of which are production cars. Also, stock Porsche’s, such as those equipped with sport exhaust option (or even the Macan’s factory exhaust) are pretty loud.

As for F1 tech, that is truly awesome. I have always marveled at the way F1 cars utilize tech on the bleeding edge, such as the KERS systems, the method of cutting ignition to corresponding cylinder during shifting (McLarens do this, which results in flames from the factory lol), anti-lag, aerodynamics, cooling, etc.

You did mention “up to the speed limit”. Not sure where you are located, but if you are ever in SoCal, I’ll take you to a track

Anyways, i digress. I think my main point is that everything might seem a certain way on paper or in theory, but when used in the real world, in various use cases/environments/etc, the results/performance often isn’t what we would expect.


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