ECOFLOW and Viofo

mentadent said:
Yes I think it is high because dashcam batteries are a specialist product with low volume.

I wish they would charge faster.
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They cannot be charged faster without farther negative impact on performance and reliability, they are already at their limit, and here's why:

In general, for long and reliable operation, the maximum C-rating for an LFP battery under ideal conditions should not exceed 1C. (The "C" rating is the charging current divided by the battery's Ah capacity.)
In reality it is wise to charge an LFP battery well below the max 1C-rate, especially for in-car application with an extreme temperature range and vibrations and when battery state of the charge (SoC) is fully utilized from 0% to 100%.

The most dash cam batteries are LFP with a nominal voltage of 12.8V and a maximum capacity of 96Wh or 7.5Ah (due to air transport restrictions).
For an advertised 0.90h or 54min charging time from 0% to 100%, the average charge rate for the battery is about 96Wh/0.90=107W conservatively assuming 100% charging efficiency.
With an average nominal voltage of 12.8 V, the charging current would be about 107 W/12.8 V = 8.36A, let's conservatively assume 8A as some battery specifications suggest.
Then the charging C-rate is 8A/7.5Ah=1.07C !
As you can see the charge rate already exceeds the limit and this is not in ideal conditions.

So, I think that due to the high 1.07C charge rate combined with full SoC utilization from 0% to 100% and combined with the harsh temperature extremes and vibration in the car, these batteries will never reach the promised LFP potential.

For comparison my 12.8V nominal volt (DIY) LFP battery is rated at 192Wh capacity or 15Ah.
With the same charge speed, I only get 0.53C-rate, and since I have twice the capacity I can sacrifice a small portion of that capacity to limit the SoC between 10-90% (like most power stations), which is important for long and reliable operation.
If needed, a 15 Ah battery can be charged at, say, 12A which is 50% faster than existing batteries, while still maintaining lower 0.8C-rate.

Conclusion:
To charge these LFP batteries faster they need to increase rated Ah and corresponding Wh.
Or better to use LTO battery which can be comfortable charged at 3C-rate.
 
This is why I want https://www.power-core.co.uk/products/9000lto.html so bad =) 118 Wh charged in 20 minutes vs. 79 Wh in 50 minutes (over 3 times faster, in keeping with your 3C LTO).

Lead-acid car batteries seem to have a charging rate of 60-120 watts, so about the same speed as LFP.
 
mentadent said:
This is why I want https://www.power-core.co.uk/products/9000lto.html so bad =) 118 Wh charged in 20 minutes vs. 79 Wh in 50 minutes (over 3 times faster, in keeping with your 3C LTO).
........
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It looks like they are using 18 cells in 6S3P configuration similar to this:

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256807170012456.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.3.c96b35EF35EFc0&algo_pvid=590eecf2-b289-4d7c-9420-c70c13cea749&algo_exp_id=590eecf2-b289-4d7c-9420-c70c13cea749-1&pdp_npi=4@dis!USD!27.40!13.15!!!195.75!93.96!@2101c5c217230467087468324e6590!12000040404518518!sea!US!2602377183!X&curPageLogUid=jjdVwyNgyYit&utparam-url=scene:search|query_from:

It has a fairly large footprint, they seem to favor a low height over a small footprint, probably to fit under a seat.
And yes, about 20 min charging form empty to full is about 3C-rate at about 25A and about 350W.
With this rate of charge, LTO battery/charger should be connected directly to car’s Battery/Alternator.
In my opinion the price is too high, if they can keep it in the current LFP price range they will take most of the market share.

I don't know why it is taking so long to bring it to market, the design principles of LTO are not much different from LFP.
I heard somewhere:
“If a man hasn’t proposed to a woman in the first year of dating, then most likely he never will.”
 
So I recently ordered an Ecoflow River 2 as well and wanna start doing some bench testing with it while I work on other projects. :)

How are you all managing the wiring from the battery to the dashcam? Is there a good post I can quickly reference? I haven't really messed with it too much yet, but IIRC, I saw someone mention that they're using the USB output on the battery since the cig. lighter output needs to manually be turned on which isn't great for a dashcam.

For the dashcam hardwire cable, are you running the battery and ground wires to the Ecoflow's USB port? If so, how do you do the wiring? Is the ACC cable run directly to the car's fuse box?

To power the battery pack, it looks like its cig. lighter power cable uses the same connector as dashcam battery packs and thus shares the same hardwire cable. I grabbed a spare out of my closet, but has anyone found a good place to purchase an extra one? I quickly checked BBMC and Blackvue's site, but I'm not seeing replacement PC8/B-130X hardwire cable unless I missed them.
 
Vortex Radar said:
So I recently ordered an Ecoflow River 2 as well and wanna start doing some bench testing with it while I work on other projects. :)

How are you all managing the wiring from the battery to the dashcam? Is there a good post I can quickly reference? I haven't really messed with it too much yet, but IIRC, I saw someone mention that they're using the USB output on the battery since the cig. lighter output needs to manually be turned on which isn't great for a dashcam.

For the dashcam hardwire cable, are you running the battery and ground wires to the Ecoflow's USB port? If so, how do you do the wiring? Is the ACC cable run directly to the car's fuse box?

To power the battery pack, it looks like its cig. lighter power cable uses the same connector as dashcam battery packs and thus shares the same hardwire cable. I grabbed a spare out of my closet, but has anyone found a good place to purchase an extra one? I quickly checked BBMC and Blackvue's site, but I'm not seeing replacement PC8/B-130X hardwire cable unless I missed them.
Click to expand...

There are a several ways how the River2 can be wired, with 12V out or 5V out to DashCam.
My preferred method would be 12V out like shown in attached diagram below.
In this case original HK4 can be used as is.

Use included Cig adapter/XT60 cable to charge River2 from car’s ACC activated Cig socket. (Make sure it is rated for 10A (the fuse is usually 20A for these sockets).
Splice yellow trigger wire (18-20AWG) with positive wire of the included Cig adapter/XT60 cable or use splitter like one in the link below, connect the included charging cable to one barrel and cut-off the other barrel and use positive 12V wire for the yellow trigger wire. (tape and do not use negative wire).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/B08CMT94CV

Get USB-C to 12V cable, similar to one in the link, and cut-off the barrel connector, to connect positive wire to Red and negative to Black wires of the HK4 to power DashCam. (15V cable provides better margin for 11.8V min setting of HK4 and may be better, but I am not sure without testing).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/B0CDFWRZB7

If you don’t have 10A rated ACC activated Cig socket you can similarly wire and charge form the fuse box (for the long wires 14 or better 12AWG wires would be needed) since River 2 charge rate using 12VDC is about 90-100W)

I think this should work unless I'm missing something.

EDIT: See post #57 for the video showing how this wiring works, and also for option to use USB-A to 12V converter cable, if USB-C cable requires unplugging and re-plugging to activate
GPak
EDIT 2: USB-C to 12V or 15V cable works well with River 2, it does not require unplugging/re-plugging routine and is more efficient option compere to USB-A to 12V converter cable.
GPak
 

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Are there any other LTO powerbanks available? I haven't found any.
 
mentadent said:
I came across this battery: https://ecotreelithium.co.uk/product/12v-200ah-bluetooth-lithium-battery-lifepo4/

Max charging current: 100 amps which at 12V is 1200 watts!

It has battery management system and bluetooth monitoring.

Maybe it could make my crazy dream of 24/7 dashcam monitoring a reality.
Click to expand...

You can find a large selection of similar batteries on Amazon including 300 ah and 400 ah versions.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=LiFePO4 200AH battery&ref=glow_cls&refresh=1

(I had to tell the Amazon UK web site I want to ship to Ireland for it to show me any prices when viewing from the U.S.)
 
I'm going to drive myself crazy achieving the dream of 24/7 dashcam monitoring
 
mentadent said:
I'm going to drive myself crazy achieving the dream of 24/7 dashcam monitoring
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I wonder how much recording/monitoring time you could actually get out of one of these big deep cycle trolling/solar/golf cart LIFePO4 batteries?
 
I never get more than 12 hours with my 250 Wh of Powercore. I should use a multimeter to see if my car is sending enough current to it. Or give up this quest.
 
It is funny, they make portable battery powered aircon and cooler / ice cube maker and what not, but no one thought about making a dashcam power bank that could be taken out of the car and used for other stuff.
 
What a weird world
 
mentadent said:
I'm going to drive myself crazy achieving the dream of 24/7 dashcam monitoring
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Lets make your dream come true: :)

You can get Ecoflow River2 Max with double capasity and double charge rate for about $299 (amazon US)
Budget version

............... or Ultimately

You can get any of those very high Wh/Ah LFP Batteries with BMS and combine with the new Victron Orion XS 50A DC-DC charger (they just came up with the new generation very efficient one), like shown in attached napkin sketch.

Your $$ and your car's alternator are the limits.
 

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mentadent said:
I never get more than 12 hours with my 250 Wh of Powercore. I should use a multimeter to see if my car is sending enough current to it. Or give up this quest.
Click to expand...

I don't know how you've got the Powercore wired in or how you are using it but you might consider getting one of these USB inline multi-meters. They will show how much current passed from the battery to your device and record how many hours/days/minutes/seconds the current was flowing, plus a lot of other data. There are many of these on the market at different prices and with different capabilities. These things are pretty handy if you have dash cams and power banks or external battery packs. I have a couple of cheap, basic ones like the Charger Doctor and the Keweisi I paid only a few dollars each for and they do a great job but some of the newer more sophisticated ones that have since become available are very appealing.

Keweisi.jpg


USB_meter.jpg

Features graphing
graphing.jpg

Price £23.82 on Amazon UK

Specifications:
Color: Black
Size: 61x74mm/2.41x2.91 inch
Equipment Temperature: ℃/℉
Device Uptime: 99 days 23 hours 59 minutes 59 seconds
Record Time: 999 hours 59 minutes 59 seconds

Monitor Voltage:
Ranges: 4~24V
Resolution: 0.00001V
Accuracy: ±(0.2‰+2)

Monitor Current:
Ranges: 0~6.5A
Resolution: 0.00001A
Accuracy: ±(0.5‰+2)

Monitor Power:
Ranges: 0~156W
Resolution: 0.00001W
Accuracy: ±(0.5‰+2)

Load Equivalent Internal Resistance:
Ranges: 0~9999.9Ω
Resolution: 0.0001Ω
Accuracy: ±(0.5‰+2)

D+/D- Voltage:
Ranges: 0~3.3V
Resolution: 0.001V
Accuracy: ±(1.0%+2)

Capacity:
Ranges: 0~9999.99Ah
Resolution: 0.00001Ah

Energy Used:
Ranges: 0~9999.99Wh
Resolution: 0.00001Wh

Cable Resistance:
Ranges: 0~9999.9Ω
Resolution: 0.0001Ω

Package Includes:
1 x FNB48 USB Tester

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/B0BZCTXFX5

https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=USB+multimeter&rh=n:1938319031&ref=dp_bc_aui_C_3
 
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I've got one of those power meters. I wonder if it would interfere with the magical parking mode line of the USB cable though?
I also have ordered a multimeter so I can measure how much current is coming from my car to the Powercore when it is charging.

River Max double speed charging looks very promising.

#obsession
 
mentadent said:
I've got one of those power meters. I wonder if it would interfere with the magical parking mode line of the USB cable though?
Click to expand...
That's a good question I hadn't thought about.

It could be that the meter would provide a lot of useful data anyway even if you can't trigger parking mode while using it.
 
That Victron looks sweeeet. The blue plastic of all their products makes me want.

I think my car may have a Smart Alternator, which could be reducing the speed my Powercore charges. When I get my multimeter I'll be able to check.
 
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