SG9665GC V2 Frame duplication stutter.

MFE said:
Fair enough, if you're sure that's the case. Let's see how it all goes.
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We've been doing some investigating today and I'm sure it's firmware related, have worked out the pattern already just need to confirm the cause

it's not hardware and nothing you're doing wrong on your end, lucky for us you spotted it though
 
jokiin said:
We've been doing some investigating today and I'm sure it's firmware related, have worked out the pattern already just need to confirm the cause
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Cool, could you let us know what not to do?
 
Feitelijk said:
Cool, could you let us know what not to do?
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at the moment we've been able to replicate the problem and have a fixed pattern to analyse, will be a matter of working out what is happening that coincides with that, it's maybe something I can't tell you not what to do, fortunately it's a duplicated frame rather than a dropped one so it's extra data which is annoying but better than lost data, we'll work it out
 
Extra data? I assumed it overwrote the next frame, but if it is really a duplicated frame should be relatively easy to debug.
Good work!
 
Feitelijk said:
Extra data? I assumed it overwrote the next frame, but if it is really a duplicated frame should be relatively easy to debug.
Good work!
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yeah it's a duplicated frame, certainly better situation than a dropped frame, still a priority though, we're doing some other IQ related fixes right now so the timing is favorable
 
jokiin said:
at the moment we've been able to replicate the problem and have a fixed pattern to analyse, will be a matter of working out what is happening that coincides with that, ...
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If it's any help I went back and checked some of the older files I still have from my V1 (original release) cam.

Video I captured on Mar. 31, 2015 shows the frame replication. I'm pretty sure I was running the original release version of the F/W at that time.

Another sample from June 2015 running F/W 20150305 has the issue as well.

Just passing this information on in case it helps isolate the issue.
 
thanks for that, it's likely been in there for a long time but never been picked up before, might be something we'll have to push Novatek for a fix for if it's in the SDK, whatever it is we'll work it out
 
DT MI said:
If it's any help I went back and checked some of the older files I still have from my V1 (original release) cam.

Video I captured on Mar. 31, 2015 shows the frame replication. I'm pretty sure I was running the original release version of the F/W at that time.

Another sample from June 2015 running F/W 20150305 has the issue as well.

Just passing this information on in case it helps isolate the issue.
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Okay, glad it's not just me then.
 
MFE said:
Heh... the whole "human eye can only see 24/25 fps" myth is exactly that - a myth. Try telling a professional gamer that there's no detectable difference between 30, 60, and 90fps on a PC
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This is true, when i use to play FPS games on my computer i was running at around 200 Hz on my CRT screen and the same number of FPS in the game.
And when i tried to play on a friends LCD screen or for that matter just looking at the game running on it i was like WTF ???? how can you play with this flashing "poo".

Due to lack of driver support for my CRT screen i only have 85Hz now, and i have gotten used to it, but i would prefer to get into the 3 digits Hz again.

Anywy cant play anymore as the games they make are crappy in my perspective, too much stuff in them i cant be bothered with as a old school FPS gamer.

I will have to give this a closer look next time i get the SD card out of my V1 camera, but overall i cant say i have been bothered by this, but its not often i have gone over the footage with a fine toothed coam.
 
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kamkar1 said:
This is true, when i use to play FPS games on my computer i was running at around 200 Hz on my CRT screen and the same number of FPS in the game.
And when i tried to play on a friends LCD screen or for that matter just looking at the game running on it i was like WTF ???? how can you play with this flashing "poo".

Due to lack of driver support for my CRT screen i only have 85Hz now, and i have gotten used to it, but i would prefer to get into the 3 digits Hz again.

Anywy cant play anymore as the games they make are crappy in my perspective, too much stuff in them i cant be bothered with as a old school FPS gamer.

I will have to give this a closer look next time i get the SD card out of my V1 camera, but overall i cant say i have been bothered by this, but its not often i have gone over the footage with a fine toothed coam.
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But when you saw a video made by 9665 in your computer. Can you detect any different before ? :D You have one 9665, haven't you ?
 
thancam said:
But when you saw a video made by 9665 in your computer. Can you detect any different before ? :D You have one 9665, haven't you ?
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Some people honestly don't seem to either see the stutter, or are not bothered by it. For me, it's immediately noticeable, but I've always had rather "sensitive" eyes, probably the result of me being a migraine sufferer. I haven't played computer games for the last 10 years because frame rate inconsistency would give me a headache really quickly, and even though I'm running a Titan in my current rig I just can't be bothered with it any more.

VR helmets intrigue me, but when I tried a Gear VR and the frame rate stuttered, immediate nausea for me. The more expensive ones might work better, but I'm not about to spend thousands to find out.
 
PS: I agree the problem must be solve. I am just curious about someone can see a different in single frame which display in very short time. :D Thanks for explaination :D
 
MFE said:
Some people honestly don't seem to either see the stutter,...
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thancam said:
...I am just curious about someone can see a different in single frame which display in very short time....
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I probably saw it but it's easy to attribute it to a playback issue that you see on YouTube on occasion. It's really only 'obvious' when the vehicle is moving quite slow and you just happen to notice that it repeats every 3-4 seconds. Once you do see it it's quite easy to spot from then on.
 
DT MI said:
I probably saw it but it's easy to attribute it to a playback issue that you see on YouTube on occasion. It's really only 'obvious' when the vehicle is moving quite slow and you just happen to notice that it repeats every 3-4 seconds. Once you do see it it's quite easy to spot from then on.
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Yes, my first assumption was that my computer was choking on the video file on playback for some reason; plenty of custom encoded MP4 files can stutter on playback if played with the incorrect playback codec, or are re-encoded with frame rate mismatches. When I noticed the stutter was in the same position of the playback every time though, I got suspicious and started doing the frame by frame analysis, and found the duplicated frames.
 
Greetings,

Just wondering what sort of time-frame we are looking at in regards to getting this problem resolved? I would like to hold out for this camera due to the superior night-time performance, but if we're looking at longer than a couple of weeks for the issue to be addressed I might have to invest in a different capacitor-based camera in the meantime. (DCOA have refunded me for the returned cameras, fyi.)
 
MFE said:
Greetings,

Just wondering what sort of time-frame we are looking at in regards to getting this problem resolved? I would like to hold out for this camera due to the superior night-time performance, but if we're looking at longer than a couple of weeks for the issue to be addressed I might have to invest in a different capacitor-based camera in the meantime. (DCOA have refunded me for the returned cameras, fyi.)
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all being well we'll be testing an updated beta version in around 2 weeks, there's actually a long list of fixes and changes we're working on which means the firmware will take a bit longer than usual between builds
 
It's interesting; I've recently detected this frame duplication stutter in several clips. I had seen it previously and thought it was local to my computer which sometimes strains while viewing videos under the load of often running Mac OSX and Windows 7 Pro simultaneously on a two monitor computer. I can understand why some may be unhappy with a problem like this but when I consider some of the other issues I've been dealing with in the SG9665GC and stop to think about exactly why I have dash cams in service, this seems like a very minor problem. Nevertheless, glad to hear it is on its way to being resolved.
 
actually the issue has been there since day one and was never picked up, it's quite easy to overlook and just think it's the computer that is failing to keep up as that's a fairly common occurrence anyway, it's in other cameras based on the same chipset also and no mention of it on those either for much the same reason I guess, once you know it's there then of course it's much easier to spot when it happens, we've already established there's a pattern to and it's now a matter of rectifying the underlying cause
 
Dam...As long as you see it, you can not unseen it....Please don't try it...
 
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