Adorama has the WR1 for $69+FS but is on backorder.

Dashmellow

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I want VIOFO to be successful with stable global team effort pricing and a good support network. The brand is more important than the current product for sale. Any seller that guts the market with stupid low and below cost pricing for their own loss leader marketing campaign reasons is not helping VIOFO at all.

You've just got to be kidding with an attack like this on a company like Adorama claiming it "guts the market" for a camera they put on the market at an attractive pre-release price like this for merely two weeks until they actually got it in stock!
 

OCD Tronic

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VIOFO already cut off several sellers for stupid low prices not following MAP. (and not providing warranty support adding insult to injury) If someone wants to spoil their VIOFO seller relationship over short term selfish loss leader tactics that's on them. (another one "bytes" the dust I guess)
 
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jokiin

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Gee, I dunno but they have sold the entire Viofo line for quite some time now, not just the WR1. Customers seem contented. Like I said, there is a very long time prevalent business practice, especially in NYC called "grey market" and this may be an example of that. It involves importing international goods from the open markets rather than necessarily through the usual channels. Grey market goods would not be a normal part of international trade all these years if it didn't serve a decent purpose. It is entirely legal. Then again, whether Adorama's selling the Viofo line is even grey market or otherwise I wouldn't know.

It's curious how you guys keep attacking a venerable retailer like Adorama?

I'm not attacking them, just repeating what has been said here previously, past 30 days customers get referred to Viofo in China for support

I wish it were that easy...

@viofo I just got off of the phone with Adorama's customer service and they informed me that I'm past their 30 day return period, so I have to pursue this as a warranty claim with you. I'll send you an email at the support@viofo.com address

if the product were grey market I'm not sure they would be able to send people to Viofo for help, that would seem to imply a legitimate source for the product, the same source says there's no stock headed their way

They didn't get any from us, and we will not ship to them due to limited quantity for first batch.

so advertising what they don't have and don't have coming as yet is ok, and because they're a big company they somehow also get a free pass on support if they sell cheap, whatever :rolleyes:
 

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MAP? Whoa, that's something I have very strong feelings about :mad: Once an item is sold and paid for it's no longer yours to control.

All that MAP pricing doers is ensure that the consumer can not price shop to get the best deal, which means that they are almost positively not getting the best deal possible :(

Phil
 

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MAP? Whoa, that's something I have very strong feelings about :mad: Once an item is sold and paid for it's no longer yours to control.

All that MAP pricing doers is ensure that the consumer can not price shop to get the best deal, which means that they are almost positively not getting the best deal possible :(

Phil
++1
 

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Interesting thread.

I was reading the reviews for Adorama on resellersratings.com and although their rating is 9.27 out of 10, very many of the good reviews are fake. One or two sentences with nothing specific, like "Great products and shipping".

I only write reviews if the product or service is bad or if it is exceptional. If it is exceptional I am going to say why and not just some generic stuff like "Great customer service".

The negative reviews say they purposely oversell and then cancel the backorders with no notice and they say Adorama has admitted they oversell. Also reports of being sent used stuff as new and only being offered a partial refund.

I am thinking they must offer customers a chance at a sweepstakes for writing a review because it is obvious so many are fake.
 

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I've been dealing with Adorama for 35 years. They are one of the two largest and most knowledgeable professional camera dealers in NYC. (the other is B&H Photo) I've visited their store on W18th Street many a time. They have branched out onto more consumer oriented camera products like dash cams but they are not generally in the business of servicing warranties from Chinese vendors... or Nikon and Canon for that matter. Still, they are as solid and trustworthy a vendor you will ever find. If there is a problem or you don't like the camera and want to just return it they will take excellent care of you. The have carried the full line of Viofo products for quite some time now.

I appreciate @jokiin's efforts to steer business toward his "network" but people should be aware of good alternatives and question why he is "smearing" a firm like Adorama.

I was surprised to see you are a well known member here because you sound just like the shills for Adorama on resellersratings,com. Many, many fake good reviews, and the bad ones say they have admitted to knowingly overselling and then canceling backorders with no notice. Also reports of being sold used stuff as new and then only offering a partial refund.

I don't know how or why they offered the WR1 for below cost but I suspect the orders will get canceled with no notice.
 
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Whatatay

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It could also just be that they are confident that the "unallocated" WR1 would sooner or later be "allocated" to them and available to them so they offered it at a killer price of 69 bucks until it was actually in stock. I've been monitoring this deal for weeks and the "underground" has been too. ;)

Maybe they were just seeing if there was enough interest in the product to stock it. Once they saw there was, they would order them as stock, cancel all the backorders for the $69, and then sell at a slightly less than normal price hoping to get orders from all those whos $69 backorder was canceled.

Perhaps it was a price mistake as someone else mentioned and they are going to cancel the backorders.
 
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Whatatay

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Edit: I will say it is **** of the company to offer a product they knowingly don't have.

According to reviews of Adorama this is a common practice with them.
 
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I am thinking they must offer customers a chance at a sweepstakes for writing a review because it is obvious so many are fake.

IMHO the vast majority of reviews found on all seller's sites are either fake or worthless in nature. One must sort past that kind of crap to find a modicum of truth, and even then you haven't got much to go on. Not just Adorama but everyone :(

Phil
 

Whatatay

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I dunno, a retailer stating upfront that for the listed price, a deeply discounted item is back-ordered seems like a decent proposition. It's nothing different from what the more familiar dash cam vendors call "pre-order", only without the hype.
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There is a difference.

A pre-order is when the retailer knows they will be allocated a certain quantity and knows they will get them and won't be canceling the pre-orders.

Offering a backordered product at a deeply discounted price below cost with a Viofo rep stating none are allocated to that company sounds like a scheme to get traffic to their website and then cancel the backorders.
 

Whatatay

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a loss leader is generally something you have in stock (legal requirement in our market, maybe yours is different) just to get the customer in, really only applies to brick and mortar retail though, not online sales, buying online people will just buy so no real advantage to selling something below cost

I agree. Like offering an oil change below cost and then selling the customer a $4 air filter for $12. Also getting people in the brick and mortar store forces them to see other products and tempt them to buy them with displays and signage showing sales or discounts.

advertising something you knowingly don't have is called bait and switch, after they collect the money and you find out there's no product to offer the alternate offers start happening

In Adorama's defense their website states they don't charge your credit card until the item ships. Now if they cancel the backorders and offer and alternate product or price I would agree with you.

there is also the possibility that they just screwed up and advertised the wrong price, that doesn't get around the fact that they're advertising a product that they haven't got coming but could still explain the below cost pricing, mistakes do happen, that still doesn't get around the fact that they only support the product for 30 days though and that is something that should be taken into consideration when ordering

I agree but with their reputation for overselling and canceling backorders without notice a pricing error is no big deal to them.
 

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I was surprised to see you are a well known member here because you sound just like the shills for Adorama on resellersratings,com. Many, many fake good reviews, and the bad ones say they have admitted to knowingly overselling and then canceling backorders with no notice. Also reports of being sold used stuff as new and then only offering a partial refund.

I don't know how or why they offered the WR1 for cost but I suspect the orders will get canceled with no notice.

Like I say, I've been a customer at Adorama for over 35 years and have spent thousands of dollars on professional camera gear and other items. They have always been a knowledgeable, trustworthy vendor. Never had any issue with their integrity in all these years or had them cancel an order. They are a big, well established company that has been around long before the internet and I don't really buy into this fake review business. This seems like nothing more than a red herring. It's hardly worth the trouble to a well known primarily brick and mortar business of that size.

In all these years, not once have they ever canceled an order on me. One time I did get an email informing me that a lens I ordered would not be in stock as soon as they expected and they didn't know quite when it would be in stock. They offered me the option of cancelling my order or waiting for the item. I chose to wait and it arrived sooner than I expected. They did n0t charge my card until the day it actually shipped.

Maybe they were just seeing if there was enough interest in the product to stock it. Once they saw there was, they would order them as stock, cancel all the backorders for the $69, and then sell at a slightly less price hoping to get orders from all those whos $69 backorder was canceled.

Perhaps it was a price mistake as someone else mentioned and they are going to cancel the backorders.

Again, Adorama is a big NYC company that deals in high volumes, they don't play games like that.

Do you have an actual example of an order being cancelled or is that just hearsay?
 
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Dashmellow

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VIOFO already cut off several sellers for stupid low prices not following MAP. If someone wants to spoil their VIOFO seller relationship over short term selfish loss leader tactics that's on them. (another one "bytes" the dust I guess)

Hah! That's funny! It would be like a supplier cutting off Walmart for selling their products at too low a price or not liking their business practices. :rolleyes:
 

Whatatay

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Do you have an actual example of an order being cancelled or is that just hearsay?

Since I don't have access to their company records I don't. I am going off of reviews. Why would people post a review saying their backorder was canceled without notice if this wasn't true? However, in those cases they product showed in stock and after they ordered they received an email saying it was backordered and then canceled without notice.

At least with this deal they said up front it was backorded.
 

Dashmellow

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Since I don't have access to their company records I don't. I am going off of reviews. Why would people post a review saying their backorder was canceled without notice if this wasn't true? However, in those cases they product showed in stock and after they ordered they received an email saying it was backordered and then canceled without notice.

At least with this deal they said up front it was backorded.

I imagine it could happen that sometimes orders might get cancelled but if it does I suspect it is a tiny portion of the number of sales they make on any given day.

I've been to their store on 18th Street in NYC many times. The place is always packed with customers. They come there because they get good service from highly knowledgeable sales people and find prices that are lower than elsewhere. A vendor of this size that does the kind of volume they do doesn't really have any reason to devote the time and resources to petty BS. One thing I really like about dealing with them is that when I am interested in an item I see on their web site I can call them up and speak with a salesperson or a customer service person. They are always helpful, accommodating and provide solid advice and info you can't get from a web only vendor.
 

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Dashmellow

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Surprisingly they have an "A" rating with the BBB but some negative reviews. Here are more reviews with quite a few negative ones.

https://www.consumeraffairs.com/cameras/adorama.html

I read one where the guy ordered a TV and it was backordered. Two months later he still didn't have it despite the website showing it back in stock.

More negative reviews here, just the opposite of resellerratings.com, https://www.yelp.com/biz/adorama-new-york-2

You sure seem to have it in for these guys considering how many times you've posted on this. People who have had bad experiences with a company tend to be far more vocal than people who have positive experiences so I rarely pay attention to this stuff.

Obviously, you've never bought from them so everything is hearsay as far as it goes for you.
 
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Whatatay

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ok, they don't have it, it does show on backorder so that's a fair thing, if they deliver the product there's no bait and switch going on, however Viofo already stated they're not getting any so how are they going to fill the backorders I wonder

Okay I did a search for "Adorama backorder" and found it is a frequent event with them with backorders still not being filled two months later.

So they will fill them months from now when they price probably has dropped to below the $69 price.
 

Whatatay

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You sure seem to have it in for these guys considering how many times you've posted on this. People who have had bad experiences with a company tend to be far more vocal than people who have positive experiences so I rarely pay attention to this stuff.

Obviously, you've never bought from them so everything is hearsay as far as it goes for you.

I am just posting the things I have seen. People who have bad experiences do tend to be far more vocal, but if there weren't bad experiences there wouldn't be these vocal people. Lots of people reporting backorder products and other shady practices like used equipment being sold as new, canceling orders but then are sent and customer billed, billed more than once, order canceled but no credit to credit card, not able to get a refund on returned products.

By the way their customer service has been outsourced to the Phillipines while B & H still has theirs in New York.

One of two things are going to happen. Either the orders will be canceled or the cameras will be sent eventually. Neither is necessarily bad. Hopefully they will come through.

Now if they cancel orders but still charge credit cards or do something like buy defective used cameras for pennies on the dollar and sell them as new, that is a problem.
 
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