MicroSD options, including MLC cards

[Deacon]

It doesn’t say anything about what type of memory it is or what limitations there are to the warranty, but with that much space the hope would be writes are spread out quite a bit over time to reduce wear on any one block. I imagine those running basically 30fps front and rwar 24/7 parking modes and such would probably benefit!

 

[AndrewL]

According to this bit of Samsung news from May of last year, it looks like it is actually MLC in V-NAND configuration, which is how they got 128GB into a microSD form factor. And it looks like they planned to have 256GB versions available, though it doesn’t appear to be in existence today. I’m not sure if or when they’ll make it. For now 128GB is the max size.

https://news.samsung.com/global/video-5-years-vs-3-months-samsungs-new-pro-endurance-memory-cards

I had an interesting discussion about whether Samsung Pro Endurance is MLC or TLC and Samsung's deceptive labeling practices.

Samsung uses a marketing term for their 3D TLC NAND calling it "3-Bit MLC", which isn't a real thing. 3-Bits is always TLC. Extremetech talked about that same issue here as Samsung used 3-BIt MLC in their marketing materials for their 970 Evo SSDs.

So even though Samsung labels the Pro Endurance MLC, that doesn't mean it's actually MLC. Confusing and very annoying for consumers. I spent a ton of time researching the latest cards and I still managed to miss this issue.

 

[Nigel]

I had an interesting discussion about whether Samsung Pro Endurance is MLC or TLC and Samsung's deceptive labeling practices.

Samsung uses a marketing term for their 3D TLC NAND calling it "3-Bit MLC", which isn't a real thing. 3-Bits is always TLC. Extremetech talked about that same issue here as Samsung used 3-BIt MLC in their marketing materials for their 970 Evo SSDs.

So even though Samsung labels the Pro Endurance MLC, that doesn't mean it's actually MLC. Confusing and very annoying for consumers. I spent a ton of time researching the latest cards and I still managed to miss this issue.

The "M" in MLC is for "Multi", so it is perfectly reasonable to use it for Bi, Tri, Quad, (2, 3, 4 level) etc. cells. Just a case of different people having different meanings for the same term.

What matters is the lifespan of the cells, not how they achieve it, and since the Samsung Endurance is specified and guaranteed for around twice the lifespan of most of its competition, it is not really an issue, as long as it really does have that endurance, and it is very rare to hear of people having issues with Samsung Pro MLC / endurance cards, or their SSDs which use the same technology and have been very popular.

 

[AndrewL]

The "M" in MLC is for "Multi", so it is perfectly reasonable to use it for Bi, Tri, Quad, (2, 3, 4 level) etc. cells. Just a case of different people having different meanings for the same term.

I agree it's the technical definition but in common usage, MLC is exclusively assigned to 2 bits of data/cell. You really have to go out of your way to find people referencing MLC as a catch-all term. I think Samsung's playing games if they want to use MLC as a generic term for 2-bit and 3-bit.

What matters is the lifespan of the cells, not how they achieve it, and since the Samsung Endurance is specified and guaranteed for around twice the lifespan of most of its competition, it is not really an issue, as long as it really does have that endurance, and it is very rare to hear of people having issues with Samsung Pro MLC / endurance cards, or their SSDs which use the same technology and have been very popular.

I agree and I'm especially happy with the 2-year and 3-year warranty on their cards. I think their endurance calculation is a bit suspicious. If you crunch the numbers for hours, it's exactly the equivalent to the years on their warranty. Ex 3-years is exactly 26280 Hours and the endurance rating on the card. No way that's a data-driven number.

 

[Nigel]

I think their endurance calculation is a bit suspicious. If you crunch the numbers for hours, it's exactly the equivalent to the years on their warranty. Ex 3-years is exactly 26280 Hours and the endurance rating on the card. No way that's a data-driven number.

Samsung have always been happy to replace cards that fail before their specified write limit, whatever you have been using them for, and whatever actual warranty time period they were sold under, so calculating the warranty period from the write endurance specification is perfectly reasonable. I think you will find that, as in the past, if you make a claim within that period they will reject it if you have exceeded their write limit, and if you make the claim after the warranty period they will accept it if you are still below the write limit. It does suggest that they have very good confidence in them reaching their specified write endurance, and they will probably continue working long after, although they may become too slow for dashcam use soon after.

Working out if a card has actually died is a bit difficult when their speed degrades rather than them actually dying - there is no exact answer, which is why they base their warrantee on the card total write count, and why they ask you to return the card so that they can check the write count.

 

[AndrewL]

Yup that all makes sense. I think Samsung has consistently put out a quality product and has backed it up with good customer support. I just wish the labeling was clearer.

 

[the_weasel]

I am currently testing one of the new Kingston endurance cards in my SG9663DC, so far it work fine but the 128 GB card have just filled up one time so far.
No info if it is MLC or what, warrantied 2 years for dashcam or CCTV use.

This are the cheapest endurance cards on the Danish market ATM

@kamkar1 any updates on how this card is doing?

 

[kamkar]

The Kingston endurance are still performing well and are still in service in my SG9663DC camera, i now think it is a safe recommendation for the SG cameras, but also overall, though i have yet to test it in other brand cameras, but it will not be long before i move the card to something else.
Price on this card jumped up significant after i got mine, i assume the retailers forgot to add in their cut and just posted what they paid for it, anyways it did not jump to the price of the expensive endurance cards here, so still a card people should consider i think.
They do only carry a 2 year warranty where other endurance cards can do as much as 5 years, but i only expect 2 years of a memory card in a dashcam, anything past that i just chalk up as cool.

 

[the_weasel]

Thank you, the 128GB kingston is £19 here compared to the samsung at £38 from CCL in the UK.
I'll get one ordered this next week

 

[SawMaster]

Just ordered two 128GB Samsung EVO Select cards from Amazon US. Only $20.99 each which is less than what I paid for the same cards in 64GB just a few months ago. It seems timing is everything with card prices lately!

Phil

 

[meanie2]

From VIOFO A119 V3 thread

VIOFO A119 V3

Kingston ones on Ebay have a lifetime warranty and seem to work great for me

dashcamtalk.com

Just back in from a trip out and sure enough the Transcend card was causing those random issues earlier with missing footage thanks - with the Integral Ultima Pro 256GB card all files are 3 minutes as expected

This was the exact Transcend card that didn't work well at all for me on firmware 1.02:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/B07C9PVLN8
I notice Amazon UK are pushing Arcanite cards as part of their Accelerator program so I guess there will be people using those popping up soon - no idea how they're performing but they're an Amazon exclusive and if they're no good they'd get sacked off very quickly.

we've returned several hundred of those same cards

Avoid this card at all costs. (Nothing but trouble)

 

[Deacon]

From VIOFO A119 V3 thread

Avoid this card at all costs. (Nothing but trouble)

That’s just a picture and does not say what card it is. All we know is it’s a 128GB Transcend card, and it doesn’t say whether it was simply defective or if there’s some known issue with it.

The Samsung PRO Endurance 128GB is still going strong and seems to be living up to its specs. So far no regrets.

 

[OCD Tronic]

Random Beeping? Transcend 64GB/128GB (Black/Silver) cards (Contact us for replacement.)

Attention Street Guardian SGGCX2/SGGCX2PRO customers that purchased between the end of 2018 and May 2019. If your dashcam came bundled with a black and silver Transcend 64GB or 128GB microSD card please contact us for replacement. The Transcend factory has confirmed there is an issue with some...

dashcamtalk.com

 

[Moon]

Transcend were a great card ... what happened? They were hard to find for a while ... Got no idea - did they change manufacturer by any chance and opt for a cheaper process? Anyone know why they are now dodgy and have their reputation going down the gurgler?

 

[jokiin]

their new High Endurance cards are probably still fine, haven't tested them though, they haven't changed manufacturers, they are the manufacturer, why they have changed these particular cards though I have no idea, I don't think it's about price as they're actually dearer than some of the other options

 

[SawMaster]

Transcend were a great card ... what happened?

I don't know but lots of people with lots of different cams have had problems with their silver cards Their old 400X was my go-to awhile back and it was superb giving about 3 times the expected lifespan for me, but it seems to have been discontinued

Phil

 

[Nigel]

Seems the top brands are experimenting with different technologies to save a few $, Samsung Endurance is only U1, Sandisk Endurance doesn't appear to have a long life, Transcend doesn't work in cameras, Samsung Evo is rather variable in speed, etc.

Whereas Viofo have gone for a proper MLC card, very fast, very consistent speed, long life?, only issue is that they are limited to 128GB:

VIOFO 128GB Industrial Grade microSD Card, U3 A2 V30 High Speed Memory Card with Adapter, Support Ultra HD 4K Video Recording

VIOFO industrial grade microSD card for extended endurance, excellent performance, and reliability. Especially for high durability applications, ideal microSD card for dash cameras, and action cameras. Suitable for harsh conditions, waterproof, anti-X-ray, and anti-magnetic. Transfer speeds of...

www.viofo.com

Maybe the big SD card brands should take note!

 

[reverend]

Just to add to the Transcend silver info, support have confirmed that they shouldn't be used in dashcams.

At least TLC cards used to work in dashcams albeit with a shorter lifespan than an MLC card, this one does not though.

 

[jokiin]

At least TLC cards used to work in dashcams albeit with a shorter lifespan than an MLC card, this one does not though.

all their prior TLC cards were no issue in dashcams, it's not the TLC that's the issue, I suspect it's the controller they're using that is the problem, not something they're likely to elaborate on though I suspect

 

[viofo]

Seems the top brands are experimenting with different technologies to save a few $, Samsung Endurance is only U1, Sandisk Endurance doesn't appear to have a long life, Transcend doesn't work in cameras, Samsung Evo is rather variable in speed, etc.

Whereas Viofo have gone for a proper MLC card, very fast, very consistent speed, long life?, only issue is that they are limited to 128GB:

VIOFO 128GB Industrial Grade microSD Card, U3 A2 V30 High Speed Memory Card with Adapter, Support Ultra HD 4K Video Recording

VIOFO industrial grade microSD card for extended endurance, excellent performance, and reliability. Especially for high durability applications, ideal microSD card for dash cameras, and action cameras. Suitable for harsh conditions, waterproof, anti-X-ray, and anti-magnetic. Transfer speeds of...

www.viofo.com

Maybe the big SD card brands should take note!

We have sent our camera to the cards manufacturer to do the data write /read testing, we can confirm VIOFO cards is reliable.

About randing beep issue, 2 days ago, I found this issue on A129 pro, at that time I am using another brand cards, then I switch to Samsung 128GB EVO plus cards, then no recording problem.