Vueroid Meetup - March 2025

[Nigel]

A super capacitor prevents file interruption but has a limited lifespan, degradeds in high heat, and may leak, causing damage.

Is that is why the Vueroid S1 is called "Infinite" - it has an unlimited infinite lifespan?

 

[Chuck McCoy]

Is that is why the Vueroid S1 is called "Infinite" - it has an unlimited infinite lifespan?

Ask Vueroid, they said it not me. lol

 

[jsmith]

Rear

Front camera is awesome looking. Rear camera with a fixed attached wire is a very bad design choice. If there's a short, you can't replaced cable, and need to buy a whole new camera.

 

[jsmith]

Ask Vueroid, they said it not me. lol

View attachment 78700

.....Supercapacitor provides power so the camera has a few seconds to properly exit the file being written before shutting down.

Certainly, lithium batteries don't tolerate heat well and end up dying rather quickly, leaving all files being written at shutdown corrupt.

Did @Vueroid invent a new method better than a Supercapacitor? .......I mean @Vueroid stating they have a software solution appears to be VERY counterintuitive. The File is corrupt at shutdown, but the Camera restores the file after it's powered on.

What happens if you're in an accident and NEED THAT FILE immediately and the Camera is renedered disabled? Or, what happens if the Camera stops working? Will any Vueroid model be able to recover the last file?

 

[rcg530]

My primary use case for the D21-4K, which has Vueroid's proprietary file system, is to turn off the input 12V power when I return home to shutdown the camera. The reason for that is the manner in which the power button works on D21-4K dash camera. When you long press the D21-4K's power button to turn it off, the "off" state is remembered the next time 12V power is supplied to the D21-4K. When power is restored, you'll see the LEDs flash on and then off almost immediately leaving the D21-4K in the off state until you long press the power button to turn the D21-4K on again. To avoid this remembered power off state, I'm turning off the external 12V power to have the D21-4K shutdown when I park my car at home.

The video file that the D21-4K is writing to when the external power is turned off has a filename extension of ".tmp" [usually ".avi"]. I can successfully copy the ".tmp" file to my computer and rename it to an ".avi" file and the video/audio stored within the file is playable.

The S1 Infinite is believed to be creating MP4 file container type files instead of the AVI file container type files. It will be interesting to see if the file(s) being written to when the external power is removed are playable as well without powering up the dash camera to "repair" them. I don't believe I will need to turn off the external power to the S1 Infinite like I am with the D21-4K, but I'll have to wait to see how it truly works.

Example from the D21-4K from last night's drive:

The 20250318_202836_INF_2.tmp file is the video file that the D21-4K was writing to at the time I turned off the external power to the D21-4K. I copied that ".tmp" file to my computer and renamed it to an ".avi" file. It played successfully using the VLC player. The renamed ".tmp" file contained 22 seconds of front, rear video / audio content. The VLC video player did not know the full length of the video since that metadata had not been written to the file when the power was turned off, but the video/audio content was there and usable.

You can see the VLC player is showing a length of 00:00 [lower right corner of VLC player] using the "tmp" file version of the video file, but the video/audio was still usable.

This morning, when the D21-4K powered up, it did rework the "tmp" file a bit. It appears to have [re]written the AVI file container type metadata so that video players know it has 22 seconds of content. The length of the media is displayed as "00:22" in the lower right corner of the VLC player window.

 

[Nigel]

The video file that the D21-4K is writing to when the external power is turned off has a filename extension of ".tmp" [usually ".avi"]. I can successfully copy the ".tmp" file to my computer and rename it to an ".avi" file and the video/audio stored within the file is playable.

Have you noticed how much video gets lost when you turn the power off? Just the last frame, or several seconds...

What happens if you're in an accident and NEED THAT FILE immediately and the Camera is renedered disabled? Or, what happens if the Camera stops working? Will any Vueroid model be able to recover the last file?

Might be recoverable with a video repair tool, although not everybody can do that, some people only have a phone.
Hopefully it is like rcg530's D21-4K, and it is written in ".ts format", even though it is inside an mp4 file.

 

[rcg530]

Have you noticed how much video gets lost when you turn the power off? Just the last frame, or several seconds...

The video/audio content seems to be right up to the point of turning off the external power. I cannot exactly tell the number of frames without a high resolution external clock visible to the camera so I can try and coordinate the power turn off event to a specific time [down to the tenth of a second].

 

[Nigel]

The video/audio content seems to be right up to the point of turning off the external power. I cannot exactly tell the number of frames without a high resolution external clock visible to the camera so I can try and coordinate the power turn off event to a specific time [down to the tenth of a second].

I would expect there to be a few buffers between the image sensor and memory card that would lose a few frames, but It may have a conventional capacitor large enough to be capable of keeping it going for a few frames.

Only issue with that is that conventional electrolytic capacitors have similar temperature limits to super-capacitors, which would make the claims above a bit suspect, maybe in 10 years time it will be losing the last second before impact even if it is good now!

 

[jsmith]

Have you noticed how much video gets lost when you turn the power off? Just the last frame, or several seconds...


Might be recoverable with a video repair tool, although not everybody can do that, some people only have a phone.
Hopefully it is like rcg530's D21-4K, and it is written in ".ts format", even though it is inside an mp4 file.

It depends upon the encoding and format of the container file. Traditionally, if the Supercap is dead or Lithium battery is dead, the entire file being written prior to shutdown can become corrupted.

Whether or not @Vueroid has addressed these concerns sufficiently is up for debate.

1. Is the last file being written upon shutdown able to be "Recovered and properly Exited" by ANY Vueroid Camera of the same Model, or only the SPECIFIC UNIT capable of fixing the file. I.E. Is the necessary code to exit the file stored ONLY on the unit itself or is this a code that one can plug in the SD card to any unit?

2. If you need the file at the time of an accident, and the camera is damaged, you may screwed. Again, the container file determines whether renaming the extension can in fact make the file playable or not.

 

[LateralNW]

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

Thanks for the screen grabs.
It looks like marketing material with no substance.
@Vueroid can you supply the patent number and details of your special file system?

They really like to bang on about super caps and how they "might" fail.
In bad designed products anything could fail but in other products we have tested the super caps seem to be working.

 

[LateralNW]

S1 4K Infinite 2CH - VUEROID Dashcam

S1 4K Infinite 2 Channel Dash Cam Front and Rear Car Camera, 4K, 2.5K Dashcam for Car, STARVIS 2, Night Vision, 24/7 Recording, 5G WiFi GPS, Car Surveillance

vueroid.com

Thanks for the info.

I see they use 12-24V input that would be why no usb power.
I also see they don't mention file type but many recording abilities.

 

[LateralNW]

Here s link to @rcg530 ces video.
At the bottom of this post.

I have taken some screen shots to help clarify my previous posts.
Power plug circular assuming it would use 5Volts

The unit I'm referring to.

Ear plug looking sockets which could mean they are using analog cameras and would like clarification.

patent file system! What is the patent number?
If it is the solution to prevent file corruption for ever I'm all in. It would be nice to know what they have done to back up their claims.

Ok we can do this now with .ts files but they're bigger than what is expected these days.

Credit:rcg530. All image screen shots from his video.
Most of my conclusions based on his early exposure to this equipment. Of course this could change considerably at anytime.

@Vueroid

 

[lufa6977]

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They really like to bang on about super caps and how they "might" fail.
In bad designed products anything could fail but in other products we have tested the super caps seem to be working.

It generally takes a lot to kill a super cap, I mean, it could happen if someone plugged the dash cam into a 48vdc power supply but generally, super caps will last a looooong time. I seem to recall they have a max high temp of around 70c or 80c, which is quite toasty. 🙂 Electrolytic will go much higher, maybe around 130c, blistering hot. As much as I like Vueroid, I think the super cap angle is a bit of marketing to be honest.

As far as file system, I tend to think that if they are writing two or more files for each channel then they are burning up CPU cycles and that might get expensive when customers want that extra channel or max bitrate or higher resolution. I would think that at each dash cam start up there is file recovery which could delay start up times. Just a guess on my part but, I would love to see the papers on the file system.

 

[lufa6977]

I think it is a lot simpler than that!
As I understand it, the actual file system is FAT32, or I assume they can use exFAT for larger cards.
The difference to normal dashcams is that they create all the files once, when formatting the disk or after changing the setup, and then never delete or create any more, just overwrite the existing files on looping, thus the FAT tables never get changed, and thus can't get corrupted.
The video files will get corrupted at their ends, but that can be easily fixed when the dashcam restarts, or when the files are played, as happens in Viofo dashcams (they also use Novatek processors).

Using .ts format would mean the files can be played without being fixed. Don't know if they do that or not, although the files are not .ts files, so probably not.

Compared to a super capacitor dashcam, they are going to lose around a second of video, the second just before impact. If they lose too much then they may loose the critical bit! Somebody needs to test how much is lost when they are available for review, I assume it is not too much, but we will find out...

That could be possible but one issue I see is block size would change if the file recording length or video options changed. This would cause a lot of wasted space on the disk, and pre-allocating file space via the FAT does not really guarantee all frames will be saved. As it is, it seems the VUEROID file system must consume a fair amount of disk space for file management and housekeeping. Of course, if one has a 256 - 512 GB SDXC then not such an issue. I am not so sure VUEROID would use a .ts format as it fell out of favor as .MP4 and others improved and progressed along.

 

[Chuck McCoy]

camera with a fixed attached wire is a very bad design choice.

If customer paid for professional installation to run camera cable in headliner, or similar they must pay again to replace if the camera fails.
If the cable is fully detachable it is much easier to just replace a failed camera.

 

[Chuck McCoy]

Q: Is the Patented File System for the D21 4K, and S1 4K Infinite identical?
Or does the S1 4K have improvements / changes?

 

[jsmith]

If customer paid for professional installation to run camera cable in headliner, or similar they must pay again to replace if the camera fails.
If the cable is fully detachable it is much easier to just replace a failed camera.

Many people pay an installer and rear camera replacement is hardest and most expensive. If camera dies, then the whole job needs redone. If cable has short in camera, then whole job ALSO needs redone.

Manufacturers make detachable cables for a reason.

 

[Chuck McCoy]

Manufacturers make detachable cables for a reason.

I’m trying to agree with you. Lol
If the remote camera fails, and it's fully detachable only the camera needs to be replaced and it will be very simple.

If the remote camera cable fails, and it's fully detachable the customer only has to spend $10-$20 on the replacement cable not $80-$100 to replace the whole remote camera.

 

[jsmith]

I’m trying to agree with you. Lol
If the remote camera fails, and it's fully detachable only the camera needs to be replaced and it will be very simple.

If the remote camera cable fails, and it's fully detachable the customer only has to spend $10-$20 on the replacement cable not $80-$100 to replace the whole remote camera.

Sorry. Did my reply sound adversarial? I meant my reply as to agree and reinforce your statement.

We're on same page. Bad design for a consumer that must pay someone to install their camera.

 

[Nigel]

That could be possible but one issue I see is block size would change if the file recording length or video options changed. This would cause a lot of wasted space on the disk, and pre-allocating file space via the FAT does not really guarantee all frames will be saved. As it is, it seems the VUEROID file system must consume a fair amount of disk space for file management and housekeeping. Of course, if one has a 256 - 512 GB SDXC then not such an issue. I am not so sure VUEROID would use a .ts format as it fell out of favor as .MP4 and others improved and progressed along.

If the video options/recording length change then Vueroid deletes all your video and creates a new set of empty files of the correct size. It only wastes a lot of space on the disk up until the first loop, after that it only wastes space for files that were not filled because of shutdowns so they have some unused space at their ends. I don't really see that as wasted space. There is nothing very special about .ts, it is just H264 like most dashcams write, but in streaming format where the file does not need to be complete with all the header information inserted at the start of the file before it can be played, it works exactly as rcg530 describes above for his D21 where the .tmp files were playable but the player could not show the video length or make the scroll bar the correct length with the video position indicator in the correct place, and it doesn't need to go in a .ts file, that is just what Novatek decided to put it in to distinguish it from their normal format, so has become a standard for dashcams.