Battery pack with 12v socket plug in?

[Dashmellow]

Given the price they sell for you'd expect it should be a decent product

Yes, the reply certainly seemed like it was from someone who didn't really know the answer and so I'm surprised that it indeed has the feature.

I wasn't aware that this was a hundred dollar 7800mAh power bank. Certainly at that price, such a feature is quite plausible but one could buy perhaps four decent quality 20,000 mAh + power banks for that price.....or another dash cam! A single 20,000 mAh bank will run two cameras for an entire day or more!

Personally, I don't get this obsession with pass-through-charging based on my four years of manual charging once every day or every few days. Even with pass-through-charging I would NEVER leave a power bank in a motor vehicle permanently, especially in hot or below zero temperatures or with the constant shock and vibrations. Li-ion power banks can take some abuse but were never intended for full time automotive installation, pass-through-charging or not!

As I speak it is -5º below zero Fahrenheit outside (-20.5º C) and headed lower! My power banks are safely inside at room temperature and one is happily charging away.

 

[old4570]

Hmmm , interesting thread !
Everything has a life span , batteries are usually measured in hours of use .
If you use your batteries continuously , then yes .. In terms of months years they will have a shorter life span than say batteries that might do 10 minutes a week .
Also other variables will come into effect , like how low the battery is discharged .. The greater the variable here and the harder it is on the battery .

Now as for charging and discharging at the same time ? If the voltage remains stable then ? The greater harm / stress would be voltage levels ( how low you go )
As well discharge current .. But to power a cam - just dont see it ...
If the power bank is large enough ( capacity ) , so that the voltage does not drop to low during times that the car is doing nothing .. And the car is driven enough to maintain a reasonably stable voltage level .
I just don't see the problem .

I wanted to put in a cam for security .. ( Parking guard )
I wanted to use a power bank with a solar panel to recharge the bank during the day as well as hard wire charging when the motor is on .

A) I need a powerbank that does not turn off during low current demand ( cam in stand bye )
C) A PB that can charge and run at the same time ( I have some that do that ) ( Actually they all do that )
D) Large enough Capacity to maintain a decent voltage level ( PB )

Then you need a good cam ...
A) Low low current draw in stand bye
B) Turns on when needed and then actually turns off recording and returns to stand bye mode
C) Decent internal battery capacity .

Some recent cams have played with refuse to turn off ! ( A little disconcerting )
For action cams thats ok , but for dash cams ?

So yeah , I am still thinking along these very lines .. ( I don't really want to do it mickey mouse - I want to do it properly )
So far the no1 issue has been the PB turning off during low current draw ... ( Not sure what can be done about that ) ...

Might require a custom solution ...
Build a battery pack ...
Connect the battery to a charger ( gets power from hard line and solar perhaps )
And then from the battery a hardwire kit to the cam ...

Perhaps a 12v gel pack in the boot ...
A 12v Solar cell to charge the gel pack ...
Is there a 12v to 12v charger ? ( many 4x4 run a second battery for fridges and stuff ) so the tech should be out there ...

 

[old4570]

Just spent some time looking at dual battery set ups ...
Very interesting ...

 

[SawMaster]

I think a wet-cell deep-cycle or AGM 12V battery is the best choice for doing this but the set up is far more involved than most people want to fool with. It's my long-term plan All the cam time you could ever want with almost no danger versus limited hours and a very real risk of disaster. Seems a no-brainer choice if you're up to the installation work

Phil

 

[DavidUK]

@Dashmellow - I'd noticed in the FAQs for Goal Zero's Venture 30 PB that the question about pass-through charging had been asked four or five times and the manufacturer always said "Yes" with no fuller explanation, BUT... I'm unsure what pass-through actually means AND if a manufacturer themselves understands what it means? Hence I didn't use the term in my enquiry as it would perhaps trigger the auto-response of "Yes".

To me, pass-through may mean to one manufacturer that the PB can be attached to a power source, and also to a accessory needing power, with no adverse effects BUT that whilst the accessory is drawing power some internal circuitry will prevent the PB from charging whilst it is discharging. This seems sensible as a safety measure so as to stop internal conflicts, but cheaper PBs may not have this safety net and instead warn in the (little read) instruction manual not to try this.

So, what I want is for the manufacturer to CLEARLY confirm:

Will the Venture 30 actually charge whilst being discharged to the dash cam, or will internal circuitry interrupt the charging process whilst the Venture 30 is being discharged?

In other words, if the cam was continually in use whilst driving, would the Venture 30 eventually become depleted or is it able to accept a higher charge than it outputs, in my case approx. 400mA, assuming an input charge at, say, 1.0A so that it would only become completely discharged once the charge from the car has been disconnected (i.e. the car parked and switched off).

This may be a little pedantic, but from what I've read it needs to be to get anywhere near the real answer. Even then, can you trust who's answering you?
Even if I get a positive answer, that it can handle what I think is pass-through charging, there's still the safety element. It's my car, not theirs!

Anyhow, I'm going with the LiFePO4 power bank solution at £20 for 20,000 mAh, and will disconnect from the car's supply when using for parking. I've come to terms with the 30 second hassle this will cause me every couple of weeks when I park somewhere dodgy.

 

[gr1nch]

If anyone is interested in detecting and comparing current and voltage measurements over their USB powered devices, these units are useful.

I can test how much current my dashcam is consuming and also check on pass-through current differentials on my powerbank (yes, I have used the pass-through function, reliably, but won't in my car now. I'll mostly use them as a parking power source and swap them out and charge them indoors if needed) . I've had one for years from a different supplier which wasn't in my order history any more - this is the closest to what has been reliable for me.
https://m.aliexpress.com/s/item/32402309405.html

Sent from my G3112 using Tapatalk

 

[Deleted member 37895]

Best Buy sells rugged battery packs made by My Charge which support pass through charging. I bought one and tested the passthrough, and it turns out that the USB port loses power for a short period and then is powered again. I was hoping to use it with my USB powered DLink security camera, but the power loss causes the camera to reboot and time to reset to 2016/01/01 midnight

 

[Dashmellow]

I've owned several of those USB voltage/current testers as they are indeed very handy.

My current favorite is this one from Keweisi: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/USB...id=72d6b7df-e952-45d2-ba91-aee735a682d9&tpp=1

The main feature I like that sets it apart from the others is that it has a built in 99.99 hour timer. Let's say you want to charge your power bank. It will tell you how much cumulative current your power bank required until it was fully charged and how long it took to charge it. It's also very handy if you wish to power a dash cam with a fully charged power bank as it will tell you precisely how long it powered the camera and how much current it used while the camera was recording. It also will handle up to 20 volts.



There are some new versions on the market that have many additional capabilities and that handle higher voltages and currents. Some of them are like tiny USB multi-meters. Haven't tried one of these yet but they look pretty interesting.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Top...ml?spm=2114.10010108.1000023.5.3e395c77S1rpPk

 

[Deleted member 37895]

Based on all my research the only options are the BlackVue PowerMagic and the Cellink

 

[DavidUK]

Based on all my research the only options are the BlackVue PowerMagic and the Cellink

Are these Lithium Iron Sulphate? If so, what sets them apart from the Tqka unit I'm awaiting, apart from capacity? Electronic wizardry I guess?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/B073QQPKVY

 

[Dashmellow]

@Dashmellow - I'd noticed in the FAQs for Goal Zero's Venture 30 PB that the question about pass-through charging had been asked four or five times and the manufacturer always said "Yes" with no fuller explanation, BUT... I'm unsure what pass-through actually means AND if a manufacturer themselves understands what it means? Hence I didn't use the term in my enquiry as it would perhaps trigger the auto-response of "Yes".

To me, pass-through may mean to one manufacturer that the PB can be attached to a power source, and also to a accessory needing power, with no adverse effects BUT that whilst the accessory is drawing power some internal circuitry will prevent the PB from charging whilst it is discharging. This seems sensible as a safety measure so as to stop internal conflicts, but cheaper PBs may not have this safety net and instead warn in the (little read) instruction manual not to try this.

So, what I want is for the manufacturer to CLEARLY confirm:

Will the Venture 30 actually charge whilst being discharged to the dash cam, or will internal circuitry interrupt the charging process whilst the Venture 30 is being discharged?

In other words, if the cam was continually in use whilst driving, would the Venture 30 eventually become depleted or is it able to accept a higher charge than it outputs, in my case approx. 400mA, assuming an input charge at, say, 1.0A so that it would only become completely discharged once the charge from the car has been disconnected (i.e. the car parked and switched off).

This may be a little pedantic, but from what I've read it needs to be to get anywhere near the real answer. Even then, can you trust who's answering you?
Even if I get a positive answer, that it can handle what I think is pass-through charging, there's still the safety element. It's my car, not theirs!

Anyhow, I'm going with the LiFePO4 power bank solution at £20 for 20,000 mAh, and will disconnect from the car's supply when using for parking. I've come to terms with the 30 second hassle this will cause me every couple of weeks when I park somewhere dodgy.

@DavidUK, you began this thread on October 15, 2016, at which time I responded to you by saying, "It is an unwise idea to charge a lithium-ion power bank at the same time it is being discharged because it puts a great deal of stress on the battery cells." I then further explained that charging a lithium-ion power pack at the same time it is being discharged "is commonly referred to as 'pass-through-charging'".

So now, some 14 months later here you are saying, "I'm unsure what pass-through actually means"! And now you suggest that "pass-through" may mean one thing to one manufacturer and entirely something else to another. For some odd reason, one way or another throughout this entire 14 month exercise you keep essentially asking the same tautological question over and over, as if somehow you may eventually receive a different answer.

As one of the members here who has tried to respond to your questions, I don't know what to say anymore.

I do think your decision is buy the 20,000 mAh LiFePO4 power bank and put up with a bit of occasional plugging and unplugging is a good one. It's a simple, straightforward, safe approach and one that I advocate. Use it in good health!

 

[Lola]

I've owned several of those USB voltage/current testers as they are indeed very handy.

My current favorite is this one from Keweisi: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/USB...id=72d6b7df-e952-45d2-ba91-aee735a682d9&tpp=1

The main feature I like that sets it apart from the others is that it has a built in 99.99 hour timer. Let's say you want to charge your power bank. It will tell you how much cumulative current your power bank required until it was fully charged and how long it took to charge it. It's also very handy if you wish to power a dash cam with a fully charged power bank as it will tell you precisely how long it can power the camera until the bank runs down. It also will handle up to 20 volts.

View attachment 35394

There are some new versions on the market that have many additional capabilities and that handle higher voltages and currents. Some of them are like tiny USB multi-meters. Haven't tried one of these yet but they look pretty interesting.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Top...ml?spm=2114.10010108.1000023.5.3e395c77S1rpPk

View attachment 35395

 

[Lola]

Are the two USB testers good ones? I would like to have one of these, I'll go to AliExpress and check them out.

 

[Dashmellow]

Are the two USB testers good ones? I would like to have one of these, I'll go to AliExpress and check them out.

I can really only speak for the Keweisi I actually own but I love it and highly recommend it! For the price you can't go wrong.

Originally there was a basic product like this called the Charger Doctor and I liked it but then I found the Keweisi on sale at Banggood. Now there are many new alternative ones appearing with added features and I'll bet they work fine. Depends on what you want to use it for I guess.

 

[Lola]

I can really only speak for the Keweisi I actually own but I love it and highly recommend it! For the price you can't go wrong.

Originally there was a basic product like this called the Charger Doctor and I liked it but then I found the Keweisi on sale at Banggood. Now there are many new alternative ones appearing with added features and I'll bet they work fine. Depends on what you want to use it for I guess.

I went there and looked at a few of them, Keweisi seemed to be the top selling brand so I'll try one out. Thanks for the information.

 

[DavidUK]

@Dashmellow - you know what pass-through charging is. I think I do. But you and others have shown me not to trust power bank manufacturers as most times they don't seem to know what their products are capable of. Hence I need them to confirm their PB conforms to what I accept to be pass-through charging as explained by yourself and others. If you find my prevarication tiresome you don't have to visit my thread any more. I won't be upset, and many thanks for your help and time.

 

[Dashmellow]

@Dashmellow - you know what pass-through charging is. I think I do. But you and others have shown me not to trust power bank manufacturers as most times they don't seem to know what their products are capable of. Hence I need them to confirm their PB conforms to what I accept to be pass-through charging as explained by yourself and others. If you find my prevarication tiresome you don't have to visit my thread any more. I won't be upset, and many thanks for your help and time.

If a manufacturer states plainly and clearly on their web site that they provide the specific feature of "pass-through-charging" in their power banks you can be assured that they do. There are very few manufacturers that offer the feature and these products are priced accordingly.

Why even bother making queries to manufactures who "don't seem to know what their products are capable of" as you put it? Logic would seem to dictate that if a manufacturer doesn't know what their product is capable of, there is a very high likelihood that the product will not have the unique and expensive feature you are hoping so intensely that it might have. Do you expect that a product will somehow have a costly feature the manufacturer somehow doesn't know about? I mean no disrespect David but this seems like madness.

And what is this statement all about? Again, with no disrespect.

"If you find my prevarication tiresome you don't have to visit my thread any more."

"prevarication"
v. pre·var·i·cat·ed, pre·var·i·cat·ing, pre·var·i·cates

v.intr.
1. To speak or write evasively. To lie.

2. To behave in an indecisive manner; delay or procrastinate.
v.tr.
To utter or say in an evasive manner.


Why?

As for visiting your thread, I was responding to your post where you specifically tagged my name and engaged me with questions and dialogue.

 

[Lola]

I went there and looked at a few of them, Keweisi seemed to be the top selling brand so I'll try one out. Thanks for the information.

I can really only speak for the Keweisi I actually own but I love it and highly recommend it! For the price you can't go wrong.

Originally there was a basic product like this called the Charger Doctor and I liked it but then I found the Keweisi on sale at Banggood. Now there are many new alternative ones appearing with added features and I'll bet they work fine. Depends on what you want to use it for I guess.

Well I went to AliExpress found what I wanted, went through the order process, when I got to where it said "Pay/Confirm" I clicked on it to confirm the order. Received message, You're not signed in, so I signed in!
Went to the item went through all again, got to the "Pay/Confirm" clicked on it, message: You are not signed in! Cancelled everything! Absolutely no way to contact them without using their "Canned" questions to your problem, which they didn't have! UNBELIEVABLE !
I will probably get a email from them tomorrow ! I guess this means I don't think Chinese, Oh Well!

 

[DavidUK]

@Dashmellow - I'm procrastinating, that's why I wrote prevarication. I'm agreeing with what you said previously.

Don't get so het up!

 

[Dashmellow]

@Dashmellow - I'm procrastinating, that's why I wrote prevarication. I'm agreeing with what you said previously.

Don't get so het up!

Although procrastination is indeed listed in the dictionary definition, the most common meaning of the word prevarication in my experience and here in the US is lying or being evasive, so I was curious about your use of the word. Perhaps the meaning and common use of the word is somewhat different in the UK? Anyway, considering our discussion and my questions about why you were still pursuing this quest after so long I was puzzled. Not to worry. Speaking of UK usage I wasn't familiar with the term "het up" and had to look it up. I'm probably not quite so exasperated as I sounded, but I'll try not to get het up.

It's a funny thing with these repeated and ongoing debates about power banks. Dash cams are a relatively new product category (as are power banks) and it comes as no surprise the people want to use them this way to run their cameras but the fact is that leaving power banks running devices permanently in automobiles is not what they were designed for. They were designed for temporary charging of mobile devices. If we had a different battery chemistry technology I suppose things would be different but for the time being we are stuck with lithium chemistry in one form or another. At it's heart power banks are power supplies from laptop computers (usually eight 18650 li-ion cells) that someone realized could be pretty useful as stand alone products but nobody would ever be likely to plug a laptop computer into a power source and leave it running in a parked car when they were away, especially on a sunny day with the windows closed.