Mobius Maxi 4K Action Camera / Dashcam

[TonyM]

Here's a better view of how I have mounted the Maxi 4K onto a wedge with dual-lock, then with VHB on to the screen.

 

[Dashmellow]

Again, a nice job @rozwell ! Nice to see someone with good DIY skills.

 

[Dashmellow]

FWIW, I've noticed that so far, eletoponline365 has only sold five Maxi 4Ks since they began offering them for sale several weeks ago. Perhaps people are waiting for the super-capacitor version (I am). Perhaps word-of-mouth alone with no company sponsored advertising or promotion is no longer viable? Or perhaps people's various discouraging experiences with the brand since the days of the original M1 have put the kibosh on the whole endeavor?

 

[rozwell]

FWIW, I've noticed that so far, eletoponline365 has only sold five Maxi 4Ks since they began offering them for sale several weeks ago. Perhaps people are waiting for the super-capacitor version (I am). Perhaps word-of-mouth alone with no company sponsored advertising or promotion is no longer viable? Or perhaps people's various discouraging experiences with the brand since the days of the original M1 have put the kibosh on the whole endeavor?

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People like me, who use it as a dashcam, need it to be reliable and I already saw at least 2 new firmwares in recent days. As much as I enjoy such updates (don't get me wrong, keep them coming! : ), I can't risk not having a crucial recording in potential accident.
My guess is more will get it, after it's been widely reviewed and tested for potential issues, and word spreads about it's existence in the first place, cause I myself come across only by chance.

There are some things missing though, H265 would be one more reason to upgrade, but with 512GB MicroSD card, I'd rather have it take less power to run longer on external battery, which leads me to another missing feature: parking mode.
To be more precise: lack of external way to switch between modes, for power and storage savings. It would be perfect to have a signal pin to switch between modes.
Right now, the only way I can think of supporting this without hardware modifications is to use USB data lines.
For example: +3V would enable mode 2 and 0V would change it back to mode 1. I don't know what USB-C specs allow these days, maybe pull-down resistor, etc.
Is there any way to contact devs for such feature request? That would make Mobius so much more powerful!

This is the reason why I'm currently wondering, if maybe I should get something like Viofo A139, which has it all butt... it's bigger and doesn't have lens extension cable to make it totally hidden, so it doesn't get stolen.

 

[Dashmellow]

People like me, who use it as a dashcam, need it to be reliable and I already saw at least 2 new firmwares in recent days. As much as I enjoy such updates (don't get me wrong, keep them coming! : ), I can't risk not having a crucial recording in potential accident.
My guess is more will get it, after it's been widely reviewed and tested for potential issues, and word spreads about it's existence in the first place, cause I myself come across only by chance.

There are some things missing though, H265 would be one more reason to upgrade, but with 512GB MicroSD card, I'd rather have it take less power to run longer on external battery, which leads me to another missing feature: parking mode.
To be more precise: lack of external way to switch between modes, for power and storage savings. It would be perfect to have a signal pin to switch between modes.
Right now, the only way I can think of supporting this without hardware modifications is to use USB data lines.
For example: +3V would enable mode 1, switching to 0V would change it to mode 2. I don't know, anything USB-C specs allow these days, like pull-down resistor, etc.
Is there any way to contact devs for such feature request?

This is the reason why I'm currently wondering, if maybe I should get something like Viofo A139, which has it all butt... it's bigger and doesn't have lens extension cable to make it totally hidden, so it doesn't get stolen.

Unfortunately, Mobius has had a checkered history since the original Mobius 1 camera. After waiting a very long time for the introduction of the Mobius 2 it was a complete disaster due to various IQ issues and a tendency to freeze up unexpectedly.
The Maxi, also long in development was a vast improvement but many people (including me) have had poor experience with the camera, also due to a tendency to freeze up and sometimes become completely bricked during the firmware update process. Firmware updates for the Maxi have been few and far between.

At the same time the company basically refuses to have any direct communication with the public including their most enthusiastic customers and supporters who made the company a success in the first place. Instead, they rely on a very small group of volunteers like @TonyM to be their public face in the marketplace, offering product support, troubleshooting advice, beta testing and announcements and promotion of new products such as with the Maxi 4K. Unlike practically every other manufacturer they don't even have a web site. You need to go to one of their key volunteer's web page to find firmware updates, for example.

Some people have lost interest at this point. There are newer dash cams on the market with the latest sensors and processors that far exceed anything Mobius has introduced because of their slow development process. Hopefully the Maxi 4K will generate renewed interest and enthusiasm for this style of camera but only time will tell. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

H.265 is still problematic in my view. The reason is that it is still not widely adopted as much as I think it needs to be. If you need to provide original footage to law enforcement, insurance companies, lawyers etc., many of these entities may not have computers that can handle H.265 video. To make matters worse, many people (like an insurance claims adjuster for instance) who might receive a copy of your video and find it won't play on their older computer. Many won't even know what the term "H.265" even means, so they won't even know what to do with the footage and perhaps they'll just move on to the next case. In my experience, I've learned that if you hand off video to law enforcement, lawyers or insurance people, you need to make the process as simple and idiot-proof as possible if you want them to pay attention to your situation. For this reason, I stick with H.264 video compression for the time being.

As for your idea for USB data lines, someone here or DCT made a wired remote control switch for a Mobius that was pretty cool. You could change modes and do other things with the camera while driving just using your thumb to operate the buttons. There's a thread about it somewhere around here.

 

[TonyM]

The Maxi 4K is primarily an action camera with some dashcam specific features. I doubt we will ever get the full range of features you might see on something like the A139.

It only takes a couple of seconds to press Stop, M, and Start if you want to switch from Mode 1 to Mode 2 recording. I think that an automatic switch to parking mode might be asking too much.

I have asked for a low bitrate option for parking or surveillance recording.

I don't think h265 would consume any less power? Maybe even more due to the extra processing required? As 4K cameras go, the power draw is already rather low, so it should last a long time on an external battery. I've not tested that yet.

There have been a couple of firmware updates lately. Nothing that affects reliability. Just added a few more resolution options.

 

[Matt_V939]

M4k is similarly specced and priced as the Gitup F1, which has interchangeable battery + screen.

What does it bring to the table? Should have a better IQ and future tweakable firmware update, but to the general user these are not killer features.
When M1 came out it was a fantastic bargain with Great video quality for the price.
Action cameras and dashcamera price were higher and there was not much choice.
Now, for action cameras there are a TON of options even cheaper with decent features.
Even for airsoft you can buy (Runcam) similar shaped camera with factory installed 16, 25, 50 mm lens.
I do not use Mobius shaped camera as dashca because there are lots of more dedicated options with dedicated features (impact detection).

IMHO price/quality for the M4k is too high in the current market. The unique features (fmware flexibility & evolution) are interesting only for a tiny minority of users, all other users are served with many other options.

I am a bit surprised too about the only 5 units sold, I was among the first who bought the Mini when it was released and even that fared better (but again, it was unique).
Mobius developer has been releasing too late its models into the market, following the M2 problems.
the 808#32 needed 2 years since when it was ''announced'' on Chuck Lohr's website (dec'18) to the release and it seems also that one, despite the price, is being sold in low numbers.
BUt that's only on ebay. What seems strange is that both the m4k and the #32 are not available (e.g.) on Banggood which has M1, mini, Maxi 2.7k for sale.

 

[rozwell]

@Dashmellow, @TonyM H.265 obviously requires more (processing) power, but it's great for storage and it's a cool feature, but just like I mentioned, I'd rather have it take less power (therefore use H.264) and with 512GB card, it's nothing important.
When it comes to sending the video to anyone, I can always convert it to any format with one command, that's not a problem. Even 4k resolution could be a no-go for people with old PCs but that shouldn't stop us from using it.

@Dashmellow I found that thread and I could make a circuit to simulate pressing that button automagically, but that's bound to fail eventually, because you have to press it more than once and with delay in between. It's too annoying in a daily use, you have to remember about it every time.... A solution to "install and forget" is needed.

@TonyM It's good to know, the firmware is kept stable, thumbs up for that! About switching modes, if they were OpenSource, I would add this feature myself (I'm a programmer) but I doubt they will ever do that, even though, that would make the camera way more popular (TS100 soldering iron, anyone?). Nevertheless, for someone who knows their code, it shouldn't be much of a problem, and would be a perfect addition not only to the dashcam way of using it, but I bet people with drones etc. will benefit from that too. I believe the best would be to use a pull-down resistor (so nobody accidentally gives 14V on these data lines) and you can do that with a relay, transistor, mechanical switch, etc.
Could you please at least mention that to the devs? It would go perfect with that surveillance recording, you know

 

[TonyM]

I do not use Mobius shaped camera as dashcam because there are lots of more dedicated options with dedicated features (impact detection).

Maxi 4K does have impact detection. But yes, in general dedicated dashcams do have more dedicated features than a general action camera, such as parking mode, GPS etc. It is possible these could be added in future updates, but no guarantees of course.

M4k is similarly specced and priced as the Gitup F1

Similar size, shape and spec. F1 will suit some users better. Others may prefer M4K.

After testing & using both for a few years (F1) / months (M4K), I can see benefits to each camera.

 

[Matt_V939]

Maxi 4K does have impact detection. But yes, in general dedicated dashcams do have more dedicated features than a general action camera, such as parking mode, GPS etc. It is possible these could be added in future updates, but no guarantees of course.


Similar size, shape and spec. F1 will suit some users better. Others may prefer M4K.

After testing & using both for a few years (F1) / months (M4K), I can see benefits to each camera.

About the F1 and M4k, I mean the M4k is sort of 2 years late and pricewise seems not that competitive given the similar features but eg. lack of screen.
M4k makes sense with its price in the mobius range positioning vs old m1 & mini, but not against the competition.

 

[Dashmellow]

@Dashmellow, @TonyM H.265 obviously requires more (processing) power, but it's great for storage and it's a cool feature, but just like I mentioned, I'd rather have it take less power (therefore use H.264) and with 512GB card, it's nothing important.
When it comes to sending the video to anyone, I can always convert it to any format with one command, that's not a problem. Even 4k resolution could be a no-go for people with old PCs but that shouldn't stop us from using it.

@Dashmellow I found that thread and I could make a circuit to simulate pressing that button automagically, but that's bound to fail eventually, because you have to press it more than once and with delay in between. It's too annoying in a daily use, you have to remember about it every time.... A solution to "install and forget" is needed.

Yes, you can convert video to other resolutions and compression schemes but in a serious incident, especially one that might end up in court you could be asked to provide an original, unaltered, unedited copy of your video. Some insurance companies require this too. In my personal experience where I had to submit a number of videos to law enforcement (CCTV & dash cam footage) I learned that it was vital to make it as easy as possible for literally anyone in the chain of custody who needed to see it to play it. You never know the computer skills of the people who will be watching your video and you have no way to know what equipment and software they are using. I agree that 4K video could also be a problem in this regard but that is usually watchable for many even without a 4K monitor whereas H.265 can be a showstopper for some. Of course, this is all changing as computers are becoming updated. Apple computers for instance will automatically detect and switch to H.265 or H.264.

Glad you found the thread with the Mobius remote. I haven't seen it in years so my memory of it was a bit fuzzy.

 

[TonyM]

seems not that competitive given the similar features but eg. lack of screen.

If the screen is a deal-breaker, choose the one you want. Screen or no screen.

Personally, I never liked driving with the F1 at night because you can't turn off the bright LCD screen. I always wanted to tape over it.
However if I want to change any camera settings away from home, then the buttons & screen on the F1 make that task much easier.

 

[Dashmellow]

About the F1 and M4k, I mean the M4k is sort of 2 years late and pricewise seems not that competitive given the similar features but eg. lack of screen.
M4k makes sense with its price in the mobius range positioning vs old m1 & mini, but not against the competition.

I agree with a lot of what you've said here. I guess with the Mobius it is the form factor. We have to remember that the original design goal was as a small, lightweight FPV drone camera and that is still the case even though it is marketed as an "action camera". For some the stealthy aspect of the camera makes it appealing as a dash cam along with the fact that Mobius camera have a reputation for being especially durable and long term reliable as dash cams. I too think it is priced somewhat too high considering it has no screen and lacks features found in similarly priced competitors.

 

[Matt_V939]

I agree with a lot of what you've said here. I guess with the Mobius it is the form factor. We have to remember that the original design goal was as a small, lightweight FPV drone camera and that is still the case even though it is marketed as an "action camera". For some the stealthy aspect of the camera makes it appealing as a dash cam along with the fact that Mobius camera have a reputation for being especially durable and long term reliable as dash cams. I too think it is priced somewhat too high considering it has no screen and lacks features found in similarly priced competitors.

If the screen is a deal-breaker, choose the one you want. Screen or no screen.

Personally, I never liked driving with the F1 at night because you can't turn off the bright LCD screen. I always wanted to tape over it.
However if I want to change any camera settings away from home, then the buttons & screen on the F1 make that task much easier.

@Dashmellow: sure, I have 3 M1 still going strong. I am just trying to explain than back then when there were not many options for this type of video quality (expecially at this proce range, there were NO other options) thus mobius could be used in other scenarios which it was not designed for. Now the situation is very different, that's why M4k might not have the success its precedessors had

@TonyM:NOT a question of being a deal maker, I was just discussing the price: for a camera W/O a screen compares unfavourably with one with a screen. The poin is not being a deal maker, but judging the price being too high compared to alternatives.
Don't understand why these type of topics can't be discussed as simple facts.

 

[TonyM]

When I have time, I plan to compile a few basic comparisons with a factual feature list and a day & night video sample:

M4K vs GitUp F1
M4K vs Mobius 1
M4K vs Viofo A129 Pro

 

[atlex]

M4K vs Viofo A129 Pro

Please!

 

[Necromancer]

Having different features is the plus in itself. H265 may not suite everyone. nobody is asking to force H265 on everyone, just the ability to choose between the two.

I personally would like to run it at H265 and generate a smaller file size with the same details, Don't care about power consumption running on a supercap.
Though if the camera was not designed to support H265 from the start, i doubt it ever will.

The Mobius #1 served me well, and is still the one working in my car after my Mobius #2 broke (again).
The bad experience i had with the Mobius #2 made me reluctant to by more. I tried the A119 but had bad experience with it too.
The small form factor for the mobius is really a big plus to me, and am willing to try the Maxi 4K, hopefully it'll be as reliable as the Mobius 1.
Though as written, it is not designed specifically for dash-cam use. I actually find it a bit confusing, as i think the demand for dashcams is huge, maybe even more so than for action camera's.

 

[TonyM]

Though as written, it is not designed specifically for dash-cam use. I actually find it a bit confusing, as i think the demand for dashcams is huge, maybe even more so than for action camera's.

The release version has a battery and an F2.8 wide angle lens. This is particularly suitable for action camera use.

There will be a second version with a capacitor and a faster lens - better for dashcam use.

 

[Necromancer]

The release version has a battery and an F2.8 wide angle lens. This is particularly suitable for action camera use.

There will be a second version with a capacitor and a faster lens - better for dashcam use.

do you have an approx time frame for it? weeks? months? lemme know when available.

 

[TonyM]

do you have an approx time frame for it? weeks? months? lemme know when available.

I expect weeks rather than months