Why not parking mode on the side cameras in a 4-camera/ch setup?

[poodlewidamohawk]

Fairly new to the world of dash cams. My only (brief) experiences so far have been with a Kenwood DRV-410 and a Compustar Dash. The KW had g-sensor only (no motion detection). Among other problems with the dual 720p Compustar, it featured a waay too much blue LED spyro-gyro "look at me" lighting.

Background: I was recently keyed for the first time ever. This seemed very personal and also, wildly excessive. It happened at work, and the way we have to park, anyone can approach from the E,W,N, or S and leave the same way.

Ideally, I will be able to figure out which reasonably-priced discreet little beasts can hold up to 70C/152F temps. The ideal camera(s) will have a capacitor, parking mode, maybe even the ability to partition 'parking' and 'events' since I am far and away much more interested in what happens after I park my vehicle and leave it for 12 hours. Oh yes, I'll also need a Cellink B. And a GPS, but just to track the time. (Having to toggle through tons of extraneous video really busted my chops, especially when it defaulted several hours' worth to Jan 1, 2000 at 12:00:00:00.)

In my case -- using dash cams to capture people approaching my vehicle -- wouldn't parking mode be necessary on all four cameras? Or could I get by with maybe just F/R parking mode, and G-sensor on the sides? Would they work in tandem with one another, even if it was four dedicated dash cams (not 4-channel)? Any advice greatly appreciated.

 

[kamkar]

Welcome to the forum.

You are right if anyone got it in for you and go for your car they can approach it from the sides and leave the same way, this will to a large degree be dictated by the layout where you park and human nature.

But in general at the parking lot problem where the person parking beside you nick your car while getting into the bay or leaving it, then they will often be captured on the front and rear camera, so in general i think those 2 will be enough for parking guard.

They might also slam their door into the side of your car, but that should trigger a event recording and hopefully that's still going then they get into their car and leave, or will be captured by motion detect, though i think that feature on a busy parking lot will generate a lot of false positives, but at least the right positive should also be among them.
Ans the door hitting your car should trigger G-sensor recording so that give you a time frame to look for in between all the motion detect recordings.

You light even be able to do with just the front camera if you reverse into parking slots, that way the front camera will most lightly be pointed in the right direction.

In a parking space the vehicle next to you is pretty close so not sure if a side camera will capture plates on the other car.

Also if you are living in one of the hot states then daytime temperatures + the cameras running too during that may actually force a thermal shutdown.
Those hot temperatures really put a damper on what you can do for parking guard, cuz just the sun will heat up the inside of the car to unbearable temperatures, and then adding the camera running / standby that might put you over the max temperatures the hardware can take.

 

[poodlewidamohawk]

[/Quote]...just the sun will heat up the inside of the car to unbearable temperatures, and then adding the camera running / standby that might put you over the max temperatures the hardware can take.[/QUOTE]

Thank you for the information. I hadn't even thought about the cam(s) themselves producing heat. We must park in full sun, at the end of a dead-end road. The lot itself is surrounded by fence on three sides. There's a single turnstile entry point (no guard). The lot is never over half filled, so there can be empty spots on either side and in front of me throughout the day.

I was hoping to help combat the intense sun heat by getting cam(s) with capacitors. I also thought the cam(s) might go into a "sleep" mode or something and just turn on when they detected motion or an impact, which surely wouldn't happen very often, especially if I tweaked the settings a bit.

For what it's worth, I had two game cameras bungeed to the back seat, each filled with 8 AA batteries, and nothing exploded on a 152F day. However, I don't think the game cameras could see through the (street legal) tinted back glass, either. I was hoping actual dash cam(s) could "see" better through tinted glass. Now that I think about it, the Compustar Dash's rear camera never showed anything but still shots with no motion (no cars, people, etc.): I thought maybe it was just turning on when the front camera turned on. Now I'm wondering if maybe it couldn't see out of the tinted glass either.

Much to think about. Thanks again.

 

[SawMaster]

More to think about is the current being used which may drain a car battery or powerbank in a few hours time. It's usually better when possible to have external cams watching the car.

Phil

 

[poodlewidamohawk]

[QUOTE="It's usually better when possible to have external cams watching the car. Phil[/QUOTE]

Agreed. However, my employer hates this kind of stuff. Also, I'm pretty sure their only response will be to increase patrols. For the time being, I'd prefer my ops not be misconstrued by their ops.

Two thoughts: This heat will break soon (fall). Also, maybe I could get by with 2 dash cams: One aimed towards left fender, one towards the right bumper. Or something.

Dash cams are still very rare in my part of Flyover USA. Will definitely need help moving forward, and have little idea of what to do. All I know is, I don't want any more ugly jagged street tattoos placed on my shiny new car.

 

[kamkar]

The current dual channel cameras is laggin in some ways, so what i would do is get a single camera and the reverse into a parking bay at the fence, and one that have prebuffered event recordings.

Prebuffer mean you will get some seconds of footage from before the triggering event, and really that's the only way of doing parking guard.

Now parking guard don't really have my interest so i am not fully on top of that, but i know most of the Street Guardian cameras have that ( bar the 9665GC )

Normally the 2 main heat generators in a camera is the DSP chip and then the image sensor itself.

There is better dual camera dashcams on the horizon, but this is at the very tail end of this year and the start of next year.
This will also be cameras that will offer a much better low light performance on the front camera.

 

[Dashmellow]

I have four cameras that I use for full time parking mode when away from my vehicle using two 20,000 mAh power banks that will power the cams for an entire day. The ones facing the sides and rear are Mobius 1 cams with super-capacitors. My truck is dark blue and it can get like an oven when sitting in the sun and so far after more than two years using Mobius cameras in my vehicle they are still running fine. Then again, I don't usually run them for more than about say 6 hours at a time using 64GB memory cards, however the Mobius can accept a 128GB memory card that will record for up to 19 hours at 15Mbps. At extreme temperatures like you describe I probably wouldn't use power banks, instead opting for a car battery protection device. The Mobius is a small, discreet, affordable and highly reliable camera that lends itself well to this purpose and it may be worth considering. I find the Mobius "C2" lens option to be ideal for side camera coverage and with the four cameras running in my vehicle I achieve complete 360 degree coverage with a good amount of overlap. To be honest the temperatures you describe might be pushing it with just about any camera running for such long periods, even with a super-capacitor but the Mobius may well be up to the task. If this concept appeals to you it might be worth experimenting with one Mobius camera and seeing how it works for you.

Here is a left side video sample in a supermarket parking lot.

Here is how the camera is mounted in the rear window of a Tacoma pick-up truck. (The window is darkly tinted so the camera is quite stealthy, being fairly hard to see from outside the vehicle.)

 

[poodlewidamohawk]

Excellent. Exactly what I had in mind. Coincidentally, I went foraging through old posts here (should have done that first) and found very helpful other posts from kamkar1 and yourself. At this rate, should be able to pull the trigger on a purchase real soon. ...next read, a car battery protection device...thanks.

 

[Dashmellow]

There is a lot of good commentary and imagery in THIS thread if you haven't yet found it.

You'll see one of my favorite side cam parking shots of a guy checking out the stuff on the back seat of my truck without realizing there is a camera right in front of his face.

 

[SawMaster]

I was hoping Dashmellow would chime in Where there's a will there's a way. I've found that most companies do not understand their liabilities for what occurs on their property- they too must follow the law, and they cannot both disclaim liability while disallowing you reasonable means of protecting yourself against them. So they could be sued over this and regardless of that outcome it would cost them time and money and could be repeated almost indefinitely claiming a different aspect of the situation Taken to management informatively rather than confrontationally should net you permission to either install some game cams at your own risk or to have their maintenance people do that, especially if you're willing to allow them access to all data recorded which will enhance everyone's safety. You could also make it clear that they are legally responsible for their employee's action while on their property so that if you can prove another employee did this they are going to be in a deep legal mess which you'd rather avoid seeing happen Subversion works- just make them see that their own decisions will adversely affect them unless they allow you to help protect yourself against crimes occurring on their property. And remind them that if indeed it is another employee who did this, that their dismissal will send a clear message to all employees that such crass behavior will not be tolerated making any potential future behavior problems far less likely to occur

You mentioned their fence; if it divides their property from someone elses they do not control what happens on the other side of that fence and perhaps you can park where a cam you placed off-property would cover you. Look around on other properties nearby for security cams- there may be some coverage already in place. Always keep your eyes and mind open for all the possibilities and then you'll begin to see more opportunities to better your own little slice of the world

 

[kamkar]

The mobius make for a excellent side camera, i would hate if mine in the left side broke.
In the other side i have the discontinued innovv C3 that also do perfect, it just have 2 minuses, mine is the 90 degree lens version ( you will want a wide angle lens on a side camera ) and then it have the occasional magenta flash here 1 frame in the steam get a magenta hue.

I think in the case i would just go for record all the time too, i do that while driving so why not when parked.

Only problem would be those rare but good Danish summer days with temperatures over 30 degrees C

My mobius is on the headliner with neodymium magnets so can be taken off in no time ( folded up pice of metal to slide over headliner and still be able to slide under rubber that hold headliner up above the door frame, placed just behind the B pillar so ppl exiting or entering my rear seat have minimal chance of bumping camera.

My innovv C3 is mounted 2/3 up the back side of the B pillar, its just installed with the innovv mount and double sided tape ( i don't know why it has not fallen off as only 1/3 or so of the mount surface/ tape is griping plastic on B pillar.

Normally i don't have ppl in the rear seat, don't have that many friends to fill my car, but i can do it with the family i see on a regular basis.

For the most its just me myself and i in my little red Suzuki just the way i like it.

 

[TMB]

The mobius make for a excellent side camera, i would hate if mine in the left side broke.
My mobius is on the headliner with neodymium magnets so can be taken off in no time ( folded up pice of metal to slide over headliner and still be able to slide under rubber that hold headliner up above the door frame, placed just behind the B pillar so ppl exiting or entering my rear seat have minimal chance of bumping camera.

Did you have to modify the Mobious mount or is it magnetic out of the box?

 

[poodlewidamohawk]

=opportunities to better your own little slice of the world

Very good info --I, too, am glad Dashmellow (and Kamkar1) weighed in on this-- but I'm basically left to my own devices here: If I go to management with this problem, I may be 'shut down' on the dash cam idea as well: They are very strict about privacy. I'd rather take advantage of the fact that the parking lot is 'technically' the county's responsibility, even though it is surrounded on three sides by company property, plus the county road leading in. It's highly unlikely that anyone unfamiliar with the grounds would venture very far into the belly of the beast --it's quite intimidating for n00bs. Fairly certain this intentionally vicious vandalism came from some timid coworker I must've ticked off --but who? how? why? remains unanswered for now.

I had started to veer into the direction of Street Guardian, but Dashmellow and KamKar1's information about the Mobius (C2) is very interesting. One thing is for sure, I will have to get up to speed and make a decision while working shifts, because I want my baby to be protected when she comes out of the body shop. First world problems: Prosperous enough to have a really nice car, not prosperous enough to own a daily driver as well.[/QUOTE]

 

[kamkar]

First i tried to just glue the 2 magnets to the mobius case ( just behind the heatsink )
But that did not work at least not with the CA glue i used, so #2 time around i also glued the magnets but also wrapped a little black duct tape around them.
I think if 2 component epoxy glue is used that would be better.
So as you can see by the pictures below i use nothing but the 2 magnets and a pice of folded over sheetmetal to hold the camera in place.
In the picture i have peeled back the rubber grommet so you can see the whole setup

 

[Dashmellow]

First i tried to just glue the 2 magnets to the mobius case ( just behind the heatsink )
But that did not work at least not with the CA glue i used, so #2 time around i also glued the magnets but also trapped a little black duct tape around them.
I think if 2 component epoxy glue is used that would be better.

The silicon rubberized coating on the Mobius prevents glue from adhering. The best way to get good adhesion is to sand down the place you need to apply the glue or (carefully) use a little acetone to remove the silicon on that spot. Some people on RC Groups mention that they use the slide in cradle instead for gluing and mounting so they don't have to damage the camera itself cosmetically.

 

[kamkar]

The big issue with this way of doing things is you have 4 memory cards to retrieve when you want to get footage.
But on the other hand its rare i retrieve all 4 cameras, and also handling the micro SD cards in the car can be a issue, many users have had a card launch out of the spring loaded slot, and in some cases never to be found again.

Thats why i now pull out the whole camera so i can handle it and the little pesky memory cards at home, this way just yanking out the USB plug and then the camera off the magnet only take seconds, where fumbling with the little memory cards take a lot longer and the memory card might launch to god know where, or as in my case a brand new 64Gb card out of the open door.

However i still think in most traffic cases at least just a single front camera is enough, the other cameras is just icing on the cake and a sign of a addiction

BUT ! the 4 cameras are helpful if you like me expose dumb ass drivers on youtube, but the idiot i recently turned over to the police was just 3 files from my front camera, and with his driving that should mean he no longer have a license.

I cant wait for the good dual channel cameras, and i think any one with ideas of a extensive setup should wait for those, and make do with just 1 or 2 single cameras to tie him over untill then.
Then in a few months / half year enjoy the pleasure of donating the 1 - 2 old cameras to worthy ppl in need.

Remember the little mobius cameras don't have parking guard, and always recording mean its close to recycling the oldest files when you get off work ( assuming you have a 128 Gb card in the camera )

 

[Dashmellow]

One consideration might be the cost of the cameras. Four Mobius cameras with cables, etc., will cost about 300 dollars whereas four Street Guardian SG9665GCs will cost 800 dollars or more. In connection with that consideration, if one or more of the cameras were to eventually fail from running full time in such intense heat it would be better to lose a more modestly priced Mobius. Also, the Mobius is the ONLY camera on the market where spare replacement parts are readily available, so if a component should fail you could do a repair.

 

[kamkar]

Yeah difference in price is huge, but as this seem to be a daytime related problem i would just go for a couple of mobius cameras as that's a good and cheap way to get going.
And then re evaluate my needs next spring when there should be better dual camera solutions on the market.

128 Gb cards ( or maybe even larger ) is off course more expensive than a smaller memory card, but if you go dual channel later on thats the kind of card you would like to have in the camera anyway as then 2 cameras will be saving footage on the same memory card.

 

[poodlewidamohawk]

..this seems to be a daytime related problem...couple of mobius cameras as that's a good and cheap way to get going....2 cameras will be saving footage on the same memory card.

Excellent advice. Two Mobius cameras to get started sounds great, paired with some really good memory cards I can use later with dual cam(s). Just wish there was some way to get parking guard instead of being always on with the Mobius. Based on the footage I've seen so far, there's very little activity in the parking lot during the day except at AM/PM shift change, AM/PM break times, and lunch time (~11:00 AM - 1:00 PM. Will keep looking for a parking guard option, but it's looking more and more like Mobius. Any advice on a car battery protection device with a two-camera Mobius configuration? Thanks.

 

[Dashmellow]

If the parking guard trigger mechanism functions on impact with a G-sensor, say with a fender bender, it might not be triggered by an act of vandalism that doesn't cause such an impact like getting your car keyed. You could miss capturing the event.

Motion detection parking guard can be a problem because all kinds of events from random passers by, to wind blowing through trees, to clouds passing overhead, to birds flying by can cause false triggers. If set to be less sensitive, one might miss the event that needs to be captured.

In a situation like yours I would prefer to capture everything that goes on outside my vehicle, especially someone approaching your car from a distance. It might make for better evidence in court and be more likely to identify the individual.

Edit: Recently, I stopped at a local plant nursery to pick up a few items. When I got home, I randomly reviewed some footage from the day and discovered that some ass*ole parked next to me used the hood of my truck as a place to put down heavy gritty trays of potted plants while he and his wife loaded their purchases into their car. The front camera captured the whole act and sharp detailed images of the guy doing it. The side camera captured these selfish idiots loading up their nice new looking Honda SUV that they obviously didn't want to put the plants down onto. The side and rear cameras captured their license plate as they backed out of the parking space. In the end, I couldn't find any damage to my vehicle, so that was a relief, but if there were bad scratches on my hood I would have had the evidence I needed to do something about what happened. I don't believe standard G-sensor based parking guard would have captured this event. Pre-buffering doesn't help if the camera doesn't get triggered.