SG9665GC firmware updates and pre release access

[bn880]

Aww come on SG. (yes so a map can be coded , roughly into software. a table of sectors/zones) I guess I will just stay on the factory firmwares on these cams, as this is the main required thing.

 

[DT MI]

...(yes so a map can be coded , roughly into software. a table of sectors/zones)....

It's a bit more complicated than just a 'rough table'. A significant amount of detail is required for it to work properly - at least if you want it to be correct outside of the boundaries of the rough table. See this: https://www.timeanddate.com/time/dst/2016.html .

Also, if memory serves me properly, there are a few areas where the time adjustment is 30 minutes versus 1 hour. Factor in that the criteria can change on an annual basis and it becomes a maintenance nightmare - more so given that it would be a secondary function of the camera.

 

[bn880]

It's a bit more complicated than just a 'rough table'. A significant amount of detail is required for it to work properly - at least if you want it to be correct outside of the boundaries of the rough table. See this: https://www.timeanddate.com/time/dst/2016.html .

Also, if memory serves me properly, there are a few areas where the time adjustment is 30 minutes versus 1 hour. Factor in that the criteria can change on an annual basis and it becomes a maintenance nightmare - more so given that it would be a secondary function of the camera.

Rough function would be better than no function though. (at least if you can turn it on and off) That's how most dashcams seem to do it.

 

[DT MI]

Rough function would be better than no function though.....

Only if it works (just ask those who are having issues with exposure).

 

[bn880]

Only if it works (just ask those who are having issues with exposure).

If it works roughly it is fine. I have other dashcams that are like this and it's better than nothing. One just needs to provide a disclaimer that the limitations are X or Z up front. And with a smartly trimmed table you can get to be pretty accurate anyway.

Edit: Regardless, with a 15MB set of 28000 data points that most people use online you can be pretty much 100% spot on. Maybe the 9665 doesnt have THAT much free memory though so it would need to be a dirty set of points and not all the boundaries. Or someone would need to edit the boundaries to trim them. NOTHING of this is impossible to do. It's just a matter of planning and design (coding) before and after you make your hardware.

 

[alexp999]

If it works roughly it is fine. I have other dashcams that are like this and it's better than nothing. One just needs to provide a disclaimer that the limitations are X or Z up front. And with a smartly trimmed table you can get to be pretty accurate anyway.

Edit: Regardless, with a 15MB set of 28000 data points that most people use online you can be pretty much 100% spot on. Maybe the 9665 doesnt have THAT much free memory though so it would need to be a dirty set of points and not all the boundaries. Or someone would need to edit the boundaries to trim them. NOTHING of this is impossible to do. It's just a matter of planning and design (coding) before and after you make your hardware.

The bigger problem is trying to keep it up to date, just look at the amount of updates tzdata has on debian/ubuntu.

I'd rather just set the offset for my local time, much easier and don't have to worry about erroneous reading throwing it off.

 

[Dashmellow]

I really don't see what the big deal is setting the proper time zone manually. I mean, it takes only a moment to do and really, just how often does one have to do it?

 

[bn880]

Lets just agree to disagree then.

 

[Dashmellow]

Lets.

 

[bn880]

Hello, can someone from StreetGuardian please answer the GPS time sync question? I don't want to take just the word of people who are against the feature. Is it in the works, is it in the firmware? What happened to the promised plans? Thanks.

 

[Dashmellow]

I don't see anyone here who has stated that they are "against the feature", but as several members have pointed out there are technical impediments to incorporating it.

 

[Deacon]

@bn880 none of us are against the feature. All of us would love the feature. And your proposed solution is one they should look at and consider if they haven't already. But they've already spoken on it, very recently, saying it won't happen for this camera. See below.

the GPS data used is basically just location co-ordinates and UTC time, a GPS navigation device knows where you are as it also has its own map data overlay and it's much easier to just code in which locations are in which timezone, that only works when there is corresponding map data, it won't set times for regions it has no information about, we don't have map data to interpret locations and as time is only provided as UTC (or GMT 0) the offset to suit local timezone needs to be set, it's a very simple menu adjustment that takes about 10 seconds to do

Yes, it's maddening that in 2017 we'd have to manually switch the clock on a device like this, when you'd think they'd at least let us set our desired time zone manually so that we would only have to change it if we traveled across time zones. And even that is somewhat frustrating that a GPS-enabled device wouldn't be able to approximate fairly well when we crossed a time zone boundary and adjust on its own.

Hopefully in future cameras they'll be able to onboard not only DST zones but time zone boundaries as well, so the clock is fully automatic based on the GPS input. Hopefully.

 

[DT MI]

If it works roughly it is fine....

I would disagree with that philosophy.

If it's worth doing, it's worth doing correctly. More so when a developer/manufacturer is working with time/budget constraints, which all are, and it's a feature that's secondary to the primary purpose of the product. It makes no business sense at all to spent money that will only benefit some customers some of the time - in this case spending 30 seconds twice a year to change a time zone.

Even implementing a 'partial' solution with disclaimers will have ongoing costs because of having to deal with customers who feel slighted because a feature doesn't work for them but does for a friend who lives in the next county 20 miles away.

 

[Yooshaw]

Hello, can someone from StreetGuardian please answer the GPS time sync question? I don't want to take just the word of people who are against the feature. Is it in the works, is it in the firmware? What happened to the promised plans? Thanks.

It's been discussed:

https://dashcamtalk.com/forum/threads/sg9665gc-firmware-wishlist.18725/page-5

 

[Deacon]

It makes no business sense at all to spent money that will only benefit some customers some of the time - in this case spending 30 seconds twice a year to change a time zone.

Well from a product strategy and marketing standpoint, it can give the impression of being in the stone age. And for truckers and road trippers and those who live and work anywhere near timezone boundaries, it can be a fundamentally important consideration for the camera to update to local time automatically when crossing time zones. And for all users, but especially commercial or other heavy driving users, having the wrong time stamp because they forgot or didn't realize they had to manually change the time zone could cause confusion later.

Does that make it a top priority for individual product management? Probably not, no. But it does warrant conscientious consideration.

 

[Blackdog]

I guess from the commercial side (and I have the business sense of a dead frog) it would be weighing up the development/support costs against the possible lost sales due to this ability not being present.

Out of those who would "like" it (i.e. probably everyone, as a convenience feature), there will be a smaller group that "need" it. Those who would "like" it will just make do (as explained, for the average user it is a very quick process, that would be added to the bi-annual "changing of the clocks" routine) and those who "need" it, for reasons explained above (truck drivers etc) then they would purchase another product...and it is those "lost" sales that would need to be offset against the development costs.

However, for all we know this feature may be being built into a future product. ok, that doesn't help those without it, but that's the same with all tech....the next gen will have features that the previous gen didn't have (regardless of the hardware being capable or not).

 

[Dashmellow]

As I've watched the dash cam market, as well as this web site develop over the years I see more and more people getting absurdly hung up and complainy over one minor feature or lack thereof when the bottom line is that the primary thing that is most required is superior image quality and overall reliability. All else is almost irrelevant when it comes to the bells, whistles and minor rarely used functionalities. If there is one thing I've learned about @jokiin as he has developed the Street Guardian brand is that that is what he strives for.

 

[DT MI]

...And for all users, but especially commercial or other heavy driving users, having the wrong time stamp because they forgot or didn't realize they had to manually change the time zone could cause confusion later....

Well, I personally don't see this being developed for any consumer level dash cam for a number of reasons already mentioned (development cost, lack of maps data, specifics changing annually, hardware limitations, etc.). More expensive commercial systems targeted towards the trucking industry may be able to make a business case.

If it's that important that the displayed date/time be correct year 'round and across time zone boundaries there is a 'solution' available today. Set the time zone to GMT+0 and enter the text "D/T=GMT0" in the plate number field. The information will be correct year round, the graphic in the video will explain exactly what it is, and the GPS coordinate data will show where the camera was at a given moment so the proper adjustment can be made to determine the local date/time.

Edit:

Well from a product strategy and marketing standpoint, it can give the impression of being in the stone age.....

And putting out a product with a partial, or 'rough', solution will give the impression of it being an inferior or second rate product with haphazard development standards.

 

[Deacon]

As I've watched the dash cam market, as well as this web site develop over the years I see more and more people getting absurdly hung up and complainy over one minor feature or lack thereof

Thus the business case. If you're going strictly for a hardcore niche market, then you can lower the priority even further. If you're trying to expand beyond that, then it raises the priority of all these absurd hang-ups that so many people have, because you want them as customers. It still doesn't necessarily make it worth messing with or even possible in the first place based on the hardware chosen. But it remains a consideration to be ranked against others for limited resources.

 

[jokiin]

So I have not been able to ascertain from the changelogs or this discussion, maybe someone can answer: Is there a firmware out for the V1 or V2 cams that has the ability to automatically set the timezone from GPS, and set the time based off of that as well? (I remember being told this was being worked on a year or so ago for the next FW)

the time is automatically set by GPS, the timezone offset you need to set manually